We care because it doesn't pay down the national debt. It actually raises it in 3 ways:
1) We actually DON'T collect money the government is due that day. I.e, we miss out on some income.
2) We delay spending that can cost more in the future, think like 'late fees'.
3) We erode confidence in the government resulting in having to potentially pay higher interest rates in the future.

In general, doing nothing is pretty much the worst way of getting out of debt ever.

Why is camp BX so low, its uber ez to fill with USD...

Dude you are objectively trolling. CampBx is also lower than Bitstamp although Bitstamp is just as easy to withdraw money from as CampBx. If anything something fishy is going on with campbx, or people are just failing to take advantage of a potential arb.

They are still offering JPY withdraw. That means that although it naturally should be at a higher price than other exchanges, it still makes some amount of sense to sell there, either through hope that other people's arbitrage will drag price down, or through the hope that you can arbitrage yourself.

Why would anyone trade on gox for the sake of daytrading? Places like Bitfinex offer Bitstamp liquidity, leverage, interest, and also lower transaction fees.

Putting in a buy order just over $110 at Bitstamp, might be a good time to get them at that price. Hopefully it'll go that low.

The only problem would be if the FBI randomly sold all the BTC, however they'd have to go through about a million court cases before they could get permission to do so, by which point the Bitcoin market should be able to sustain it.

Price falls rapidly, I pull my order from $110, put it at $100. Price falls to $100, I think I'm getting a good deal. Then price falls into $80s. Sadface.

Looks like we're coming back a bit. Bitstamp is functioning non-noobishly and Gox is back to $120.

Well that was a surprisingly small deal. Even I (a bull) thought it would drop down to around $100, turns out that it seems to have taken only a $10-$20 hit.

First legit wedge I've seen on here for a while.  Most people just draw triangles to troll. Good job finding a real one.

  Firsttopostonthisthreadsinceforumcamebackup 

To remind future historians where this historical thread left off:

-> Silk road was just shut down
-> Bitcoin forum was hacked and trolled, theymos, henceforth to be known as thermos, brought entire forum down to maintain its security.
-> Huge news coverage for Bitcoin due to silk road shutdown.
-> Bitcoin regained basically all losses from the silk road debacle within a few days after its shutdown.
-> BIP 70 is a thing (why SSL, god, why???)

I'll be impressed when I finally see us break $145. Is there any way of putting a stop order on coinbase?

Bitstamp also doesn't have as much volume. So that says something.

Or, you know, you could start a business using those coins as starting capital and earn more coins by producing an actual product.

WTF?

When you dream about Bitcoin, you already know you're special.

Not really. At the point in time we were $10, we were 2/3 from the ATH, and practically everybody in the world had written off Bitcoin as a 'dead' currency. Now, we are less than 1/2 from our current ATH, and everybody has seen BTC come back, and BTC has been featured on many news stories, and  the BTC economy is a thing, so its much easier to gain traction.

If you ask a random person (ok, I live in silicon valley, so maybe this isn't a representative example, but still) about Bitcoin, they'll at least know that its a digital currency. They might not know what that means exactly, but its a gigantic step forward.

Nice shameless plug you got there.

Lol, epic fail. Is this true for everybody's september cloudhashing contracts, or just yours? Have you tried contacting somebody or something?

At least I'll have something to withdraw other than BTC, even if it is just effectively a leveraged BTC instrument :\

Sorry, I'm not getting the reference. Am I missing something?

One thing thats really weird to me is that there is almost no correlation in terms of volume between Gox and Bitstamp, at least lately. That implies that the price change that the slippage associated with the volume is small enough not to make a price change significant enough to be felt across the exchanges. Not sure if thats a good thing or a bad thing.

My chances of being able to purchase another 100 BTC now == 0.

I guess I'm back to earning my BTC the 'hard way': Actually doing work, not just draining my checking account each day with Coinbase.

Lol. I hope you're trolling (for your sake).

Why would you possibly buy feathercoins. Seriously. I thought you were adam, the bitcoiner, not one of those weirdos that buys every random cryptocoin he can get his hands on 

Oh.

I'm bad at that type of thing. Believe it or not, I still don't get it. 

Because when alts stop existing, cryptocoins as a concept (Bitcoin) wins.

There are some big-ass walls randomly getting plopped on Bitstamp right now, as well as like a 2.5% spread. Attention all bots: Potential opportunity here

For the record, Bitstamp is currently noobing just as bad as gox was last time we were at $160.

http://i.imgur.com/6FuEtS7.png

We've gone full circle.

DING 160!

MY CHANCES OF DOUBLING MY HOLDINGS ARE NOW DOUBLY FUCKED!

BUT FOR SOME REASON I'M HAPPY ANYWAY! BECAUSE ITS A RALLY!

Who the hell knows why!

So far, 3. A total of 82.36 at that price, actually.

(And yes I'm going to continue quoting that big 160 whenever possible).

One might also argue that news is immediately reflected in price-action as fast as if not faster than one will be able to obtain the news itself.

Because gold is being effectively inflated as well.

You can still use Direct Deposit, though. So you can still just move the money to another bank with international wires, or use WU. It is going to be more expensive, though.

Funny how people now expect the price to go up over the weekend, it used to be everybody expected weekend tanks.

I love consumer protections. They generally go something along the lines of "consumers can't use X unless BLAH". They make me feel very protected.

Still, this doesn't explain the cash withdraw limit.

The funny part is you then still have to wait about a week for the money to actually be transferred. Its numbers for god's sake, what takes so long? I don't even know why its so slow TBH.

One thing I've noticed that's slightly interesting is that the dollar spread between Gox and Bitstamp has remained relatively constant while the price has increased, actually decreasing the percentage spread. Not sure if this is just a market inefficiency, or it actually implies more arb is going on.

Only 25k coins on gox, now.



Another week like the last and Gox will quite literally run out of coins.

Oh my god. Really?

/facepalm

Seriously, they're running a professional bitcoin exchange, and all this time, they're using Bitcoin QT? WTF?

They've already left gox.

See, that would effectively mean all of the withdraw transactions are "pending." The BTC were debited from user's accounts, just not actually sent on the blockchain to the user's wallets.

To me, this is more bearish for Bitstamp than Gox, considering how likely a fair number of those pending coins were intended to be sold on Bitstamp for people wanting out of BTC.

Sure, but you'd think they'd at the very least have their own backup node ready to broadcast WITHOUT needing the blockchain. That seems like a much simpler piece of software than QT, anyway, and since it doesn't have to download anything, the chances of stuff going wrong is significantly lower.

If they aren't using Bitcoin-QT/Bitcoind, they wouldn't need to download the entire blockchain just to sign a transaction ~.~

Actually they are the exact same thing. QT just contains what is effectively a GUI wrapper.


Haha, thats actually not a bad idea. In times of doubt, blockchain.info to the rescue.

What are you going to attack on Bitcoin-QT that you can't attack on Bitcoind? The connection to the Bitcoin network is by far the most vulnerable place in both, and they happen to run essentially the same code.

So, Gox has Gox'd me out again.

Can't view the site, seeing price tumbling on bitcoinity. Any news?

I'm pretty happy, as hopefully this means that somebody will actually give me the opportunity to earn some bloody BTC for once.

Very panicky holding for me.

I sold over 20 BTC march 11, tell me about bad decisions.

Its probably fairly likely that people will get sub-200 BTC at about a week from now when Bitstamp finally hits the wall. Gox generally follows, even though the fiat is stuck. It'll be interesting to see how big that correction is. It might be your last chance ever to get sub-200 coins.

The spread between Gox and Bitstamp is the smallest its been in a while, percentage-wise. Its only around 5%. this either means that Gox isn't high enough & will go higher in the future, Bitstamp is too high, or perhaps the arbitrage channels are opening up again.

No, it will instead be instantly discovered as people attempt to withdraw BTC that doesn't exist.

You can delay Bank Wires infinitely, as they've shown. If you try to delay BTC withdraws, people will just stop using you.

There is, its called Bitstamp.

Gox knows that it can't "print" Bitcoin, and clearly it doesn't. otherwise, the ask sum wouldn't be so low.

On the Chinese exchanges, I can see transactions of this nature occurring, but on Gox, it would make no sense, because of the TX fees.

On chinese exchangers the only loss with a pump scheme like this would be the spread times the BTC within the range you're trying to pump by. Which could potentially be very small, given the right market conditions. This means that for very cheap a manipulator could try to "paint the tape" to make BTC look artificially high or low.

No, but I do think since they are rich, and made their own wealth, thus clearly must like money and wish to stay rich. ESPECIALLY if they earned their money through investment.

Congrats, we are there now.

The next big step will be 210.50.

Yes, sleep now.

Sleeping is the ultimate test for me last bubble. When tye bubble was growing, each day I would wake up to a higher BTC price. When it was delfating, I'd wake up to a lower BTC price. Sleeping takes away the distraction of minute-to-minute swings and just lets you judge by the general trend.


... or its just random superstition, but still. 

Zero trade fees are what's called "free market." So I have no idea why you think that would distort the market.

Sure you can manipulate volume. How will that help in manipulating price? I guess you can pick where, within the spread, the "last" price was. So? The spread isn't hundreds of yuan.

Volume manipulation can only affect price within the spread. I suppose it could indirectly affect price by screwing over other daytrader's indicators, but I don't think they could reliably do so in a way that would actually cause a defined trend in one direction.

I'm pretty sure people can arb. After all lots of the people who have money in stuff like OKPay & LibertyReserve were Chinese. Obviously if you can get money into those types of things you can use similar approaches to arb.

Whenever I try to execute any order on Gox I'm getting a timeout error, but normal use is working fine, this happening for anyone else? Its not a big deal, I only have a couple bucks in there, but what the heck?

The 230-something wall jsut got pulled from Gox & immediately posted again. I've been seeing stuff like that happening alot lately. Do the whales hope to cause a bigger panic/movement than they really can?

YOU HAVE 500 COINS??? To just drop on a single sale?

o.0 0.o 0.o o.0

Rich mofo

Edit: seriously, thats like 3% of all coins on gox.

Its on again off again. Here its off on weekends, theirs seems to be off at random times randomly.

Lol, look at that red wick

I'd panic about where to put my buy order.

Wow, Bitfinex actually makes it on that chart?

Thats pretty interesting. Is there any way of telling how much of the Bitstamp volume is secretly from Bitfinex?

Wow, looks like I'm not the only one to have discovered Bitfinex then. I was under the impression it was still a small startup.

What the heck is this?

Lol, somebody probably would find it on google earth first. Also if you're going thru all that trouble, may as well create a vanity addr

U must not disturb da "2 da moon" feelin!

So, is that a good thing, or a bad thing?

Did you sell it for 200 Gox Bux or $$$ or real gold?

Yay, looks like we're on the way down again. 

Next stop, $150. /wishfullthinking

Wow, shit. He only had 100k coins? And those were all stolen? Ouch.

Lol, what the heck.

At the end of the first camera shot you can see Craig pick himself up like "the fuck just happened".

Is the darkness of the line volume or something?

The waves have actually worked pretty well, at least for predicting a short-term correction. Hasn't worked very well with regard to how big that correction will be, though.

If its a coin, its a damn lucky coin.

Hey man how's feathercoin?

Got another buy in at higher prices, putting my recent average at $174.5. Lets see if this one gets canceled due to high risk by coinbase

Yay, for once this rally I actually bought on a dip

Note to self: Below $200 == dip.

Unless, of course, your other asset is also an investment which you can denominate in Bitcoin in the future.

The major news that could cause bitcoin to skyrocket, is if most US banks adopt the JPMorgan Chase policy of not allowing foreign bank wires for individual (non-business) accounts. Coinbase would have a field day, that's for sure.

What.

Leveraged Positions should raise volatility, because they up directional volume in the short term, and then crash it when people are forced to cover.

Especially with high, fixed, interest rates, this can do a real number.

Currently, since USD interest rates are higher than BTC, leveraged positions have a higher potential to lower Bitcoin's price than to raise it. Also, there is no recourse (on the stock market, sometimes, if you "owe" after a margin call, brokers can go after you) for Bitcoin loans. If there were, something as inconsequential as the Silk Road crash could cause a gigantic problem for pretty much everyone involved. There was obviously lots of short pressure, explaining why BTC interest rates suddenly spiked, and the price would decline further, forming an "inverse bubble". But this is all short-based, and a short-based bubble explodes in a far more problematic manner than a long-based bubble. Somebody shorting at the bottom is probably stuck paying interest rates comparable to somebody longing BTC during the long-bubble, which was like 300%. Now, when the bubble bursts, the price went from sub-$100 (even without the a shorting-bubble, with a shorting-bubble it could potentially go much lower) all the way up to $132. Somebody shorting at the bottom is unlikely to cover. Now, Bitcoin is $200. Somebody who shorted 10 BTC at 90 would now owe about 9.6 BTC, and be responsible for paying about 28.8 BTC, just in interest, per year if he doesn't pay it off. A ton of people in such scenarios would be stuck bidding for the same Bitcoins, driving the price up even further, getting each other even further into debt. Now, the brokerage also lost Bitcoins in the short term, as it lent to the people who are currently struggling to pay back that debt. So the demand goes way up, driving the price up, making that debt even bigger.

This is effectively what happened in the great depression, only in reverse, where people were "shorting" the dollar, for stock, when the dollar was backed by gold. Whenever you borrow something deflationary to use leverage to trade a volatile instrument, especially if you're paying high interest rates, you're likely to get screwed badly, especially if that debt doesn't "evaporate", but is actually enforceable.

First off, the only reason why the lenders lost only 9% is because there aren't that many borrowers.

Consider if there were a ton of borrowers, like the majority of Bitcoin speculators decided to trade on x5 leverage. Suddenly, bubbles form x5 bigger and when they crash, a huge amount of selling occurs due to margin calls, triggering even more crashing. Eventually, the margin calls can't cover the principal any more, and the person is in debt. In Bitfinex's case, the lenders would absorb that loss, and although it would be a pretty sad thing to happen, it wouldn't be the end of the world. If a brokerage came that actually could enforce that debt, however, then you get stuck into a spiral where the people at the wrong end of the speculation end up owing a sum of Bitcoin or USD that simply doesn't exist on the exchanges, driving the price up and/or down continuously until finally a default occurs.

They will let us keep 0.01 BTC. Then they will pay someone another 0.01 to convince everyone to make a satoshi divisible.

I know right? This exact same thing happens  to me. Whenever Bitcoin slows down, you either start gambling, or speculating, or doing something else reckless.

If you want money out of gox, sell on coinbase (If you're in the US).
If you're not in the US, then you can just ask for Gox withdraw in your local currency, it'll take a month though.

In all likelyhood we'll bounce off of $260 (before ATH) before continuing up on Gox. $266 is just a gigantic sized resistance its not even funny.

In case you missed it last time they showed "fun" stuff when we bubbled.

Although note he did promise not to show any more until $1000.

I've had luck with Bitfinex as an alternative to Bitstamp.

The entire world, collectively, is now getting gox'd.

This is getting absurd. I don't mean to say that Bitcoin shouldn't be going up, but what I'm seeing goes something roughly like this:

Step 1: OH SHIT GOX IS RETARDED! (*Dip/crash*)
Step 2: Why did we sell when we can only withdraw coins! (*Huge Rally on Gox*)
Step 3: Woo, I'm on Bitstamp, gox is rallying, better buy before we follow! (*Huge rally on other exchanges*)
Step 4: Yay, other exchanges are now roughly equal to gox, Gox must have fixed! Yay! BUY! (*Slow buys happen*)
Step 5: OH SHIT GOX IS RETARDED!

if people weren't damn weird, we should be permanently on Step 4. ~.~

Mine has nothing to do with newly minted coins, I don't even mine, been waiting since last night.

I actually can take you up on this. I have a history with Binaries, see this thread:

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=312562.0

Why it was moved was weird and random.

I think by expensive he means expensive compared to current Goxxian price.

He said he wouldn't do any of these until $1000.

Bitconity lied! 

Wow, no wonder I never got that.

BTCChina, where else?

Wait... did Bitcoinity just go meta?

Holy shit, I thought you died.

At this point the question is whether we can get caught in the gravitational influence of mars.

Did I miss something? We're still at like $360 per coin. How is that a crash?

Wow, today has been REALLY rocky, even by Bitcoin standards.



Seriously, each one of those "big-wicks" is almost 10% of Bitcoin's value. It's done that like 4 times already.

Lol, I hope. Either that or Bitcoin has gotten permanently more volatile and become even weirder than normal.

Personally I blame the Chinese.

March was comparitively stable, compared to this shit.

The  official bubble meter is hyping posts by max that don't pan out. 3 strikes and the bubble pops

When that happens I'll have fun creating $300 "swings" trading with myself on BTCChina.

Thats the ETF. And, yes, thats the next big event, as you can buy it with IRAS etc... not to mention the huge leverage you've got.

Gox holds significantly smaller market cap than it did last bubble.

Yet follow the green line:

Yea, that's because Gox is a fraction of the power it once was.

If we had that Bid/Ask ratio when gox was the exchange, we'd have $1000/coin easily by now.

Watch as for like the next 3 months we can't break the $395 high and we just bounce around in the $350 - $390 range. That would be funny as hell for some reason. So anticlimactic.

I'll 1-up this. If a single Bitcoin trade on gox even touches its previous all time high $266, any time this entire week, I'll double your bet.

Well that was weird. Looks like it was a one-hit-wonder by the bears, though, we're on our way back up again.

This isn't the april crash. That much is obvious. We didn't fall nearly as hard, and we've just flatlined at about $300 for a while. If we're crashing, were in for a 2010 style slow-steady-slide. I don't think this is the kind where you wake up and suddenly you see a billion cheap coins floating around and a low of like $60.

We already woke up. ~.~ Its almost 8:00 here.

Well, didn't BTCChina noob and go offline during the crash?

Yea, that's what I think. You don't have a price crash without a goxing. That's just one of the fundamental rules of Bitcoin. I think BTCChina may have picked up where Gox left off, though.

If Gox even matters any more, then the answer to that question is yes.

This is a noob picture primarily because it acts like the rallys are fast & sudden while the crashes are slow and steady. Usually, its the other way around, as rallies tend to be limited by spread of information while everybody already invested in something like Bitcoin probably checks charts daily anyway and is plenty capable of dumping without anyone telling him to.

Wouldn't gold have to halve in price, though?

Seriously, nobody even likes gox any more. People wanting to get money in and out of Bitcoin... shouldn't use gox for fairly obvious reasons, reasons that are in such a large quantity, that I shouldn't even need to list them. People wanting just to trade Bitcoin, for the sake of daytrading & the like, should just use BTCChina as its free, if they don't intend to withdraw anyway & aren't chinese. So I don't know how Gox is even a thing any more.

I'll be legitimately surprised if that's true. But, it actually seems fairly likely, looking at bitstamp's current depth.

It would be real swell if this weekend held another $80-ish dip for prime buying like last one did. Here's for them flash-bears.

Looks like we're headed to the $500 - $532 range. I think that's where the next major resistance and potential for a "crash" (you know, like last weekend) will be.

To be perfectly honest I'm fairly sure a simple trend/momentum strategy will work better here than any of this fibo/elliot shiz.

It could just be that what appears to be the chinese could just be daytraders. Seriously, when I daytrade I like 0 fees, and I don't intend to withdraw USD anyway, so who cares if its yuan-denominated instead?

What the senate says makes negative difference. What makes a difference is we're nearing $532, the official doubling point from the last ATH. Lets see if we can break it.

The top green is gox, the bottom green is finex. The rest should be rather self explanatory.

Its another one of those silk-road type scenarios.

-> Nobody cares about an event, except the impact that event will have on price.
-> That event will have no impact on price, unless people care about it.

It will either cause a short-term bubble (of the real variety) or a short term crash, depending on how people want to spin it this time. Unless something really weird happens like the government actually deciding on something, the long-term effect will be 0 on pretty much anything.

Then only care about the players you can see?

I think the chances of senators doing pretty much anything at this point is currently 0. Each senator does what they think will either (A) get them more money or (B) get them more votes. Going full dick mode on Bitcoin has the potential to do neither, and even some non-bitcoiners will view it as increased government spying (read: nobody likes the NSA) which certainly won't help that senator's popularity. About the most they'll do is say stuff like "yeah, we need to make sure it doesn't allow people to buy heroin" and not actually do anything because doing something would actually take some effort.

Back then everything was better because the page numbers didn't have a ... in the middle.

So it looked really awkward.

Thesis:

The future price of bitcoin is proportional to the number of jokes made on the most active Wall Observer thread.

Judging from BTC-E, Russians seem to be buying now like mad.

Seriously, all we need is the Iranians to hop on the Bitcoin wagon. Then we'd have Russians, Iranians, and Chinese, the grand trio of nationalities vilified by the US media.

Its because the people that run BTC-China are secretly not Chinese, but are actually aliens, who don't have to sleep. It all makes sense now.

have you ever been to Russia? Most rich people there have lots of money in USD. Since the USD exchange rate is more set than the RUR, they're more likely to spend their USD stache on BTC rather than their RUR.

For the poll, what's few??

Like, few = 4, or 8, or 16?

I can totally see $1000 before 16 weeks pass, but I doubt itll occur within 3-4 or anything.

Ok, I'm finally owning up to this now.

Me, 24 hours ago: "The senate meeting won't matter."

I was wrong.

Seriously, 50%+ increase in 24 hours.

We're in for a correction. Correction down to $600 within 48 hours, at minimum, IMO.

Looks like we're semi-stable in the $700s (yea, I know its a big range, but this is Bitcoin). By semi-stable, I mean it doesn't look like we're moving $100 a minute any more.

Half the time today when people asked me what Bitcoin was going for I didn't even feel comfortable quoting them a price.

Well, I've got to admit, that was a pretty big hit to the bids on gox.

Its funny because the BTC/Yuan and BTC/USD prices don't even match up. There's like a 25% spread at times, lol.

Me, when a crash isn't a crash:

The fact that Yuan -> USD isn't a thing.

In the last 10 minutes, $2 Billion of Bitcoin-wealth was just created.

-> Needs a random number generator
-> file_get_contents("http://data.mtgox.com/api/2/BTCUSD/money/ticker");

HSBC in general is basically the most fair bank I've ever worked with.

Unless you borrow, that is. http://www.justanswer.com/consumer-protection-law/2pkqy-want-sue-hsbc-unauthorized-overdraft-assessments.html

The last 2 hours of trading:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G152fy4fhJQ

More like everybody is running in circles.

Bitstamp noobed as well.

Yea no shit, sdev be wack yo.

Standard Deviation.

Why is Bitstamp noobing so badly?

I noted this as well. The similarities are astounding.

I think that its probable that at some point, within the next 24 hours, on some exchange, somewhere, there will be sub $500 prices.

I think we're "ringing" around $700. This means that the short term intraday bottom for this latest ring should be $655.

They never did answer the question regarding sales/income tax, which seems rather important.

Is it the IRS' job to decide if something is a capital gain or not?

Wow, the bulls and bears are quite literally chasing each other up the orderbook.

The bears are surely back, but the bulls are far from done.

The downtrend is due to the fact that the price was high.

As the price increases too fast, people sell the Bitcoin, because they want to take profit.

I think 10 BTC is a reasonable amount for 'normal' guys to be able to obtain. I don't think anybody is saying that you should suddenly go out and put a single buy order in on gox for $7000, but I think obtaining 10 BTC over the course of like 6 months is a completely reasonable feat, especially when we aren't in a bubbling phase.

Re: the credit vs. debit discussion

I'm sort of confused as to why somebody wouldn't have a credit card, if they can get approved for one. First off, if you've got a debit, then clearly you have the money you wish to spend that month. So why not use a credit card, spend that same amount, then at the END of the month pay it back, and (A) keep the interest for that month in your bank account and (B) earn some rewards for forcing merchants to pay a higher fee? Its not a question of spending money you have or spending money you don't have, if you have it, but its a question of paying that money you have now, or the end of the month, then clearly at the end of the month is better.

Actually no I didn't, whats that?

He's wrong. We're more like a quarter of the way through the early adopters phase. Early adopter implies that we have adopted not because of any innovation but because it simplifies our lives and we think its going to be successful. I think that phase is just beginning to occur. Still, most people who use Bitcoin are either using it merely because they have to in order to do what they do, or because they intend to innnovate with it in some way.

If we count this as the third bubble, that makes it Bubble Calvin.

In Honor Of Bubble Calvin.

Metatrader has this sound it makes whenever it loses connection to the internet, that sound would perfectly describe what just happened to the Goxxian Bitcoin price.

What happened on gox? Looked like a huge crash just before the shutdown.

If 100% answered "yes" then Bitcoin would have already been at $1000 by the time the poll was made.

I'm predicting $2000 before the next big crash. And this crash is going to be one for the books, I swear.

Damn after looking at Bitcoins for so long I forgot how shiny gold was.

My favorite part of that page: The disclaimer.

"This work is based on SEC filings, current events, interviews, corporate press releases, and what we've learned as financial journalists. It may contain errors and you shouldn't make any investment decision based solely on what you read here."

Oh my god we've been in a $100 range for over 24 hours, what is HAPPENING!

Why would you even need to? its perfectly easy to use one of these sites only risking the amnt for 1 deal.

You could just call them bits or bai.

Someone needs a cup of coffee really badly, I see.

Ok, I've been out of here for a while, can somebody quickly explain the joke?

What is the significance of this comment, or is it just random?

A rise that is somewhat steady, slow enough to not yet be in parabolic bubble territory, but fast enough to be definitely visible.

Feels sort of like August. Lets hope for a repeat

Wow, these guys sure have some artistic talent.

1F93htFyaPmh5E5s2eHd6ptTyEEUsU1Fu7

confirmed BTC is really working...

743af2e3c4e29cc29cb642ac1cc93c876193a06e9f9cdb86b952ca65c25f1ec8

But now I have to tamper with that txid so it looks like it isn't...

This is the only thing adequate to describe the current situation.

On second thought I'm pretty sure we're going to have to revisit $520 on Bitstamp before bottom.

Wtf is going on at stamp.... anybody else seeing this?

Lol there was a 10% spread on gox for a couple of seconds.

So either gox isn't filled with liars, or they have made so much money they might actually be able to pay out.

I like these options.

Did mtgox not go down for service? Any updates?

Hello, I just woke up, did MTGOX just come out of its repair website down thingy, or did that not happen?

Hello, I set my clock for 12AM JST, and woke up on the dot, jumped out of bed and loaded gox to see it crashing as expected, but with no news of downtime and none I can read on this thread, could some kind person from a different time zone or early waker or whatever PLZ EXPLAIN WHAT HAPPENED WITH GOX RE: DOWNTIME.

Anyone? No kind soul will inform me?

Cute.

Well, it hasnt drifted up all that much. We'll give you props when Gox doesn't fuck this up epicly and BTC starts rocketing on there.

Bitcoin won't be having an epitaph by the end of the week. Gox, however, will. Because, at the end of the day, the people who decide if Bitcoin survives or not are the people who know what they're doing. The opinion of the masses are key to Bitcoins success, but not to its survival. Only those somewhat knowledgeable in BTC are required to keep Bitcoin afloat. And, presumably the knowledgeable folks recognize Gox for what it is. The worst case scenario, and I'm talking a complete cockup, FUD-tastic, super duper media rage scenario is that BTC goes down to $100 for a year while the airwaves are purified by time.

Worst case in terms of what everybody in my neighborhood thinks of me for the next year.

The 'its all or nothing' crowd needs to learn that there's different types of "all": You can have it "all" in 2 years or look like you've got shit for the next 10 years at which point it finally takes off. At this point, the people with the coins won't be willing to let them go for too cheap. Its been integrated in too many places, used for too many things, valued too high. This means that people will have to pay for it if they want it, even in a bad scenario. And this means Bitcoin has value, and this means that Bitcoin can be used as a currency, and as long as its used, people will see how much better it is than normal currency, causing it to be used more, until its price goes up again. The only conceivable scenario in which BTC won't succeed is if somebody like Google creates their own copy and it overtakes BTC.

No it couldn't, all the alt-coins right now are bs. Bitcoin has a huuuuuuuuuuge advantage over all those crapcoins because it actually did something new, and thus had value from the beginning. The others are effectively a credit derivative denominated in BTC because the only way they're ever used is by exchanging to and from BTC.

In order for anybody to beat the first-blow advantage by BTC, it will need to be backed by a company with a budget big enough to fund an advertising campaign bigger than all the press that BTC has already gotten, and even more than that, to persuade people currently using BTC to switch. And such companies are few and far between, especially since there's no way it'll ever be used if the company pre-mines the entire goddamn thing, so there's literally no incentive for a company to do such a thing rather than just using the standard thats already there, unless they come up with something miles better (perhaps fully POS, no need for miners or something).

Google won't be funding a fontas-style altcoin pump-and-dump, thats just absurd.

I don't doubt it, but...

(1) What exactly are your sources
(2) what were they doing with the excess liquidity not held in reserve?

Should have squared it again.

5 * 5 = 25... 25 * 25 = 625... 625 * 625 = 390,625 :O

If 90% of the people selling are to buy in lower then they may as well be shorting, lol.

Does this mean gox is abut to open withdraws in some manner?

Its up on Stamp finally. Delayed rxn.

What was bizarre and artificial was the crash. What could possibly be more artificial than a 500% spread? But don't worry, it'll be even more artificial soon, possibly $500 ABOVE the bitstamp price if withdraws are opened without any limits, lol.

Draw the last chart with a slightly shorter time per candle please.

Now to be fair, even though the indicator lags a BIT, even if you dont cheat and draw the lines perpendicularly, it still works fairly well.

btc.sx

I've worked with people like this before, and I'm 99% sure this is what happens:

Step 1: After an announcement, everybody goes home sweating bullets.
Step 2: Next day everybody comes back, things are working "as intended" so you do absolutely nothing for a day.
Step 3: Finally you notice that nobody likes your "intentions" so you decide you need to do something.
Step 4: You spend half a week talking about how to get people to stop complaining while doing as bloody little as possible.
Step 5: After a week of debating you finally get the announcement written and want to release it ASAP.
Step 6: You spend about 12 hours actually completing what you plan to announce, announce it, then leave for home sweating bullets again.

Lol so many things wrong with this I don't know where to begin

SOMETHING IS HAPPENING

lol, if anybody has now is about the best time to buy ever.

I'm interested in neobee... except for a bit of a pb, I signed up for their site and verification mail hasn't come in the past hour and a half... wtf.

Its being pulled and re-posted, unless bitcoinity is glitching.

All right ya hosers whats going on in Goxland.

It FEELS like somebody is arbing right now.

Nice. And maybe you can insert a nice little backdoor in the code before you sell it, too.

Then just edit the history. Nothing is read only to mark.

We are headed to $520. I sodl in china, just as a quick short to cover the amount i was forced to sell to cover my cc bill. If all works out well ill have net gained btc in the last week even though I was forced to sell at a terrible time.

My $520 order on stamp randomly wasn't filled on the first spike down () but now just was.

well... stamp orderbooks looks fun.

GOOD NEWS GUYS WE JUST RALLIED FROM $135 TO $490!!

CAN YOU DIG IT?

SAVE DAT FAVICON! WHO HAS A BACKUP! THE PRIVATE KEY TO ALL OF THE COINS MIGHT BE ENCRYPTED IN IT!

Given this I fully expect to see $450, perhaps even lower. This is a unique not run-of-the-mill crash. This is Aprils crash, plus the silk road crash, all rolled into one. But...

THIS TOO SHALL PASS.

JUST LEAVING THESE HERE:

https://data.mtgox.com/api/2/LTCUSD/money/ticker
https://data.mtgox.com/api/2/BTCUSD/money/ticker

Functioning...

I bought at $520... was obviously a bit high but I still have my main fiat reserves waiting on Finex, they just got closed (somebody just got margin called I bet...)

Seriously considering putting a big ass bid in there right around this point... bit cautious though as this is my last fiat not intended for paying bills etc... But maybe for once I'll build an honest-to-goodness wall you can actually SEE on a chart if you look real closely My ego could use that.

Pretty good unless there's a goxxing from beyond the grave.

If there is an exchange,

and it has 10k coins on it say.

And then, 10k get stolen.

The 10k is still on that exchangers books.

but another 10 k belongs to a hacker.

So the hacker will maybe send the 10k to another exchange. Now there's 20K for the original 10k.

Now picture that for 750k. That has the potential to make a big difference.

That argument would work, except for the fact that its factually incorrect. If there weren't BTC in gox that were fake, people wouldn't have lost anything in the crash, lol. There were coins on Gox's books, and at least some of those are lost now. Those lost coins could easily be on some other exchange, effectively being double-counted.

Bitcoin is about to break out in some direction in next few hours... lets see what happens

We're in post-triangle area right now. Breakout any minute now.

Lol bitcoin tried to breakout to the upside twice, and failed both times. At least something is happening !

NICE

People pay taxes?

I think I finally have figured all this 'news' nonsense out.

I think that as of now people are just looking for an excuse to sell, its not that any of this news (at least after the Goxxing) is BAD, more like its just one more reason people MIGHT sell, so the masses, naturally wanting to be ahead of the masses, sell.  

The same exact way that when the market is rallying, any news (even news that isn't truly good) is just one more piece of good news, because its a reason people MIGHT buy, so the masses, again wanting to be ahead of the masses, buy. 

I got to say, despite how obnoxious this guy is capable of being, this post is spot on. Take everything, including the Bitcoin price, with a grain of salt, and suddenly things feel a lot better. As long as YOU now what YOU should be doing in the long run, don't second guess yourself, and rather than stressing out you'll find yourself laughing at the bears on the way up, and laughing at Gox on the way down.

Well somebody is buying.

I think its going to be trending slightly upward but with not enough momentum do do much of anything for the next couple weeks.

Much of anything from here on I mean. Well, we could easily go back to the $650s I think. By much of anything I meant we won't be entering some kind of extended strong upward trend. We'll just be bouncing around for a bit.

Well, looks like I was wrong (about us range trading after hitting $650). Hell, I'm not complaining.

lol

NO TRAINS for an entire page? ACTUAL CHARTS? Whats going on here???

Somebody just decided he needed to buy a lot. Like, just now this decision was reached.

For the moment we're stuck. But just in case I'm leveraged long BTC. That way I can earn BTC while watching my BTC go up. Fun stuff.

ok so quickly could someone tell me how this story holds any water whatsoever?

So all I have to do is find some random guy who's name is satoshi and a fairly unknown history, pay him like $50 and make him feel important, get a couple of juicy quotes, post an article and have millions of readers who instantly believe me?

And here I thought the bitcoin community was inhumanly skeptical, yet they randomly choose to believe this at face value?

What if she's short, and thinks it'll make the price go down? What if she has other financial incentives (pay based on how many people read her page)? Honestly this just sounds like complete and utter BS.

We've got to go down to at least $600 before we can re-bounce, so IDK where all this support is coming from. May as well put it at $600 to ensure it doesn't slip farther.

All these people that say that they like charity fail to take into account one simple fact: The US Government has to be about the single most inefficient charitable organization in the history of existence.

Also, if they like charity so much, then why dont they (and others like them) provide the necessary donations, if they're so sure that you won't. The answer is, because they think that you'll end up contributing more than they will, or that they'll get something out of the bargain as well.

This is why a socialist state is fundamentally unsustainable, because everybody wants someone else to be putting in more than them. So, in order for everybody to be satisfied, money has to come from thin air. Some states have chosen to steal from others to come up with this, but the US has chosen to borrow.

The main problem with ancap is that there's nothing preventing a violent gang (a new government if you will) from forming, because everyone else is being so peaceful, and if everyone else stops being peaceful, then it it isn't ancap any more - its just regular anarchy.

Ancap will only work if there is some force to stop people from conducting acts of violence, preferably some force that isn't corruptible. So, until we have open-source peacemaking enforcement droids no such utopia can exist.

Exactly, thats the point. People do have the same kinds of weapons as your gangs, so everywhere a gang would form, a counter-gang would form, and the winning gang would surely be angry at the losing gang (especially if fatalities occurred), and the losing gang would flee to a surrounding area (or get killed off). Once they flee to a surrounding area, they will pick what they think is the winning gang there, and try to join it, resulting in each area being run by 1 gang constantly in fear of being taken over by its counter-gang (who they will naturally call "criminals") and surrounding gangs who have allied with "criminals."

And then the winning gangs become governments and we're back to square 1. The problem here is human nature: Humans like to form teams, and the winning team tends to punish the losing team, who then wishes to get revenge.

Decentralized violence begets more violence, and violence begets centralization. The only way of avoiding centralization is either reducing it just enough so that no violence breaks out,  but government is still sufficiently small, or by somehow getting rid of it entirely and replacing it with a system to prevent violence hands down.

Whats this supposed to imply? That morality is supposed to change with time or something?

Whenever Bitcoin goes below $500 then I start getting worried as my credibility in "real life" starts getting hurt pretty bad. My cost average is like $200 or lower, so not panicking, but its not a very fun time to be "the bitcoin guy" right now.

Lets face it guys we're a bit fucked. The bottom line is that all money in Bitcoin eventually needs to move through the exchanges and people aren't willing to trust the exchanges. So all that BTC thats gone may affect the price upwards in the uber long term due to lack of supply, but if there isn't a safe way to express demand, supply matters not. We'll recover but this might be another 2 year ride (no guarantees, but it seems like a real possibility). I sat through one I can sit through another though, I guess.

Not really. At least, not in my experience. Even if bitcoin is bubbling, if people don't trust  the exchanges, they just won't invest, primarily because they don't seem to understand that you can be independent of credit risk by withdrawing your coins... :\

Hm I've decided Im waiting for $301.

I think people forgot just how much the Chinese like trains.

Heartbleed? IDK, there was inability to log in for some period, and that's got to cock some things up.

The 3 day macd just switched to red.

I feel like if we can get 2 green macd's in a row, we'll be in pretty good shape. We are well on our way to get the 1st, but it looked like this this time yesterday as well. On the close of the second green macd I'm buying.

could you add like, some axes or something?

Shit falling asleep tonight will be neigh impossible.

Shouldn't we at least make sure it breaks 475 before we start declaring victory.

Maybe, the logic is that they had sold some BTC, were waiting to withdraw the USD, then realized they couldn't/it wasn't safe so they re-bought BTC?

Ok we are about to break $590 on Bitfinex. The next $10 after that will be interesting to say the least.

Cmon i want my 50 coin buy order at $584 to fill. Its just $4... it would make such a big difference to meeeee.....

I have notoriously bad luck on buy orders filling. When I put a buy order on $150 on the way up, I would have gotten it filled 3 times, only coinbase kept fucking me over and canceling it. So I finally wired it to Bitstamp, and by then it was too late.

FUCK see what I mean???

Well I'd be happy because I own lots of coins. So. But, I wouldn't be leveraged so I wouldn't have any chance to grow my BTC. So.

Funny I've come to the exact opposite conclusion.

$440something

Its a bit risky but this uptrend I've made a fair amount trading it. Now granted I could have made more if I had just opened one big leveraged buy at the beginning, but I've only been in the market a few hours at a time usually.

More like, "If you want to buy/sell, wait then do it." Ok so maybe not exact opposite.

Can people please stop talkign about dark coin?

Bitcoin's corrections during an uptrend usually are either more just stalling out (like what happened  last week) or intraday. They either are volatile, or long-lasting, hardly ever both. Thats not to say a long-lasting one can't screw you with finance charges, and a volatile one can't cause a margin call, though, so its best to be careful when dealing with leveraged orders nonetheless.

If anything there are bigger corrections after breaking ATH. Remember that one day we went from like $500 to $900 to about $450 and back all in like 1 day?

Please stop you're making it worse

What the heck who needs alarms. 90% of the price action occurs in 10% of the time. Just check the price once a day with the rest of your stocks until you notice its $100 higher than you last noticed, then start obsessing about it for the next month, come out a couple BTC richer, and start ignoring it again.

Beer or bear?

Is there something... wrong with bitfinex? I notice people were talking about how it might not be legit? I can't login, .

Try to log in, says wrong password. Try password reset, says wrong email. Made a test account. Doesn't llook like you can change yur account email, so a hacker couldn't have done it. IDK wtf is going on, pretty worried.

Hey, I don't have 2fa but I have email withdraw confirmations. Yes 100% sure correct email, I even see confirmation emails in my inbox. I sent an email regarding my situation to the support@bitfinex.com. I will forward it to giancarlo@bitfinex.com. Thanks.

Bitcoins aren't "created" on an exchange. They are just, well, exchanged on an exchange. Its just one more transaction. If one wants to permanently clean his or her coins then one simply send coins from A to B and receive coins from C to D.

That zerohedge article seems actually surprisingly believable... I hate to say.

I feel like since 2008 the fed has been trying to play the entire economy like one of those single-plot-line RPG games in which you are given blatantly obvious hints of what to do while simultaneously trying to make you feel like you decided to do it.

BIS: Hey there's  a bubble...
FED: Yeah toootally a bubble...
BIS: You should pop it...
FED: NO! Why would we ever want to do that
FED: Its the market participants job to do that
FED: You hear that market participants?
BIS: ...
FED: Also we're not making our intentions clear either so yeah you're out of luck.

I don't think any of these will be true. I think it will be caused by inflation causing lenders to only issue debt denominated in btc to reduce risk. Then the rest of the economy must follow, as individuals and firms alike attempt to pay back those debts.

Why so sad erryone? Weren't we stuck just as bad in the low 500s just a couple weeks back?

Wow now -1.X% is panic? Gee maybe btc actually is stabilizing if that's the case.

I noticed this too. Somehow I doubt people will try and stop the MACD from switching. Why? Because nobody's reputation hinges on it. TA-loving bulls would probably love for it to switch, so it could switch back, and the bubble could be on its way. TA-loving bears can't declare a bear market until its red. Non-TA-loving people wouldn't care, and TA-lovers without any specific bull/bear bias would just trade with the indicator, no matter which direction it points.

Hmmm this is the slowest rally ever. Normally the price decreases slowly and increases fast (and decreases even faster during a crash).

When looking at the charts I can't help but imagine the sound of a particular animation sound effect.

"Boiiiiiing!"

Then those "big players" you speak of become manipulators.

Also, new money doesn't push out old whales if those whales are smart. A person with about 1000 coins now might be considered a small whale, if BTC were to suddenly increase to 10,000 he would still be a whale and even potentially have more market-moving power, at least that much more power over the little guys.

There's been threads here and on reddit regarding that for several days.

WTF
is this true?

I'd like to buy a vowel.

HO_L
MO__E__UCK__S

Hmmm....

I got this one...

But... WHAT ABOUT MOON

Yep

Uh oh we're back to the same price level we have been at about 1029143281 times now. Something very exciting and dramatic is about to happen.

I'll 1 up that. 10:1 against your prediction, except I'll even let you win if your bet is within 10% of the market price.

This is crazy. What is the justification for forcing someone to forfeit coins after 5 years? And how the absolute fuck do they intend to enforce that? After 5 years you can easily claim you forgot your private key, or rotate your coins to a new address, or anything of that nature.

And now you can officially be a criminal for posting a combination of characters onto the internet. Wonderful  

But this is just NY, not whole US, right? Worst thing to happen is they ban NY. Even people in NY can easily move their money outside of NY and send from there if they really care that much. I'm pretty sure Ny laws can't govern bank accounts outside NY transacting with businesses outside NY even if owner of bank account lives in NY.

Lol waffles

If we start a rally today, I'm going to be pretty smug because for once coinbase helped me make money rather than taking it from me!

(I'm still raging over the fact that at last rally I put in an order in coinbase of several BTC when it was $150 then a week later when the price was double they claimed that they had reversed it because of suspicious activity -.-)

$5 doesn't count as upwards?

Lol he didn't steal he bought them

Whats going on in the orderbooks right now is actually fairly funny, if anyone cares to watch.

I think that the things that drive BTC price up most is those that iNC enticing people to hold it, not spend it. Like when they think that fiat can be confiscated (cyprus). The rest helps but is slower.

Or... humans are just risk averse.

Big sell order on stamp

Nothing happening on bitstamp yet... eerie

Yeah only us. People have to start spending to incentivize them to continue. Believe it or not it's now cheaper to buy via coin base than with cc... if you have a fully verified coin base account that is. SO GET SPENDING. Even if you pay USD go USD to BTC to buy... it's actually cheaper that way.

CMF indicator?

I was disappointed. I thought you may have made a CCMF indicator.

wow you have to be kidding me.

Somebody needs to create a bitcoin-chart snake game.