It's one of the multiple possible plot for all this story.

Malleability bug == missing bitcoin, let's say 10K

Mark sold 1500BTC from gox treasory  @$900

Buy back 11K @ $100/$200

No more missing BTC

Why do people assume thieves are more likely to sell?

+1



that is correct. once you have used the bitcoin protocol, experience the smoothness, the speed, the power to move wealth with you fingertips, its elegance and that is it is bringing financial sovereignty to yourself, it becomes more obvious to you, that the traditional way to bank people is utterly non-modern, as outdated as public stagecoaches in times of internet/email.

the internet revolutionized the way we communicate. bitcoin will monetarize the internet and revolutionize the way we move money.

The fear that yesterdays fear might have been groundless.

Dude. Everyone wants an explanation for everything and when they can't get one they make up their own. I don't have an explanation for you. But your have nothing but pure speculation to suggest insolvency.

Unless you can get me direct access to Mark for 24 hours then I will not attempt to speculate.

You can. But that doesn't mean you are any closer to the truth than anyone else.

LOL

Really, smoothie? In the past few days, the following arbitrage opportunity has emerged: Send money to MtGox, buy up goxBTC, sell goxBTC at the going rate, liquidate the realBTC elsewhere => profit. If you can do it in a reasonable timeframe, then it's pretty good.

Y u no www.bitcoinbuilder.com ?

I didn't understand either. I thought it was mark doing some kind of manipulation to wipe out everyone who attempted to trade.

Not that I have seen since - saw that yesterday - and I am pretty convinced from having read that thread it is indeed Greg Maxwell - he basically said they still haven't fixed it, and he wasn't at all convinced they were even close to doing it.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-26316265

Just sayin

Jorge, please tell all your friends especially in Latin America (Bitcoin's final frontier) to sell all they own and put it into Bitcoin. I just learned it's going to go up 1000X. Just between us, buddy. Shhh....
http://www.bit-sky.com/index.php/english/370-chinese-corrupted-officers-will-push-bitcoin-price-up-1000-times

odds of gox btc price being null in 4 days or less??

 

So if everyone starts using litecoin what would stop "criminals, druglords and speculators" from doing the same to litecoin?

You're probably just  trolling but your argument suffers from a logical fallacy.

Who has 10k btc on stamp???  

I would be afraid that stamp would gox me or something.

Its a real wall, hes dumping.



Also, same deal @ BitFenix. Walls are both moving down with lower limit orders.

So much FUD here about walls and sells.  Never believe a word unless you have verifiable facts.

Seriously, they are following gox? Why?

Well, you are "a true believer".. what can I say. There is no point in converting someones religion.
What I see, is that the majority already has doubts that bitcoin is an pyramid/ponzi scheme. When it turns out that people lost their money on gox, then the media won't care if mtgox is to blame. The story that will get published is that people lost their money who invested in bitcoin, because this is the hot subject. Bitcoin will be known as a tool for crooks like Karpeles for scamming people. Bitcoin enthusiasts will be ridiculed as cultists or just as simple-minded victims. Companies together with serious investors will want to distance themselves as much as possible.
I believe that bitcoin won't entirely die by this, because there will be loads of religious people left behind who won't give up their beliefs. But it will regress into the play money status that can be used to buy drugs. Basically the same it was 2-3 years ago.

^^ I bet whatever he just said was a pile of shit : ) 

I also think that when I'll invest back, then I'll probably start fresh with a new crypto. What I don't like about the Litecoin market, is the single entity (or as I like to call him "The Litecoin Butcher") with it's constant 2mil.$+ buy and sell walls at BTC-E LTC market.
Considering the fact that BTC-E owners are unknown, then I seriously doubt that someone will trust this amount of money to them, if that someone isn't an insider. It doesn't make the market very attractive if you know that you are at the mercy of an single entity

1800BTC until 580 on Stamp and also a 1000BTC ask wall@580 on BTC-E.
Itīs getting cheaper every day 

You are not a Fudster normally?

But Bitcoin is a protocol and therefore it is more sensible to compare it to the history of other protocols rather than computer games?

To an extent I agree I do not think this is a Higlander scenario

There can be more than one

Bitcoin is different from protocols because it does have a very specific unit price.
Imagine if e-mail would have been created in a way that later adopters have to fill the pockets of early adopters, so they can also send an e-mail. People wouldn't accept this and would create an alternative where everyone has a fair chance with using this protocol.
So, in my idea, bitcoin is not neutral enough to be called an protocol. Gaming suits better to it, especially with the amount of gambling that's happening at the markets.

Until the gox situation is clear.

Money is the ultimate network effect. How is any other crytpcoin supposed to have less volatility than the one with the largest market cap? If volatility slows adoption, and I think we all agree that it does, then it's a huge hurdle to overcome.

Money is the ultimate network effect.

I hear you and I am a true beliver in the power of the network effect if a company/coin is lucky enough to ride that wave (after wave, after wave, eeek Tsunami)

But

A coin that was more evenly distributed with no huge holders, that traded on an exchange with high liquidity or a decentralised peer to peer exchange between wallet holders, with a baked in exchange into the client.... may have less volatility.

Also I think that volatility is what caught a lot of peoples attention to Bitcoin... so it is a double edged sword.

Also something great may come along, I am already diversified, I like Bitcoin but I also like some other cryptos that are popping up, dare I mention them here
but like Nxt and Mastercoin, Protoshares that I think may have some potential , especially with the DAC's and colour coins etc...  there is the potential to create some stable currencies using those protocols, as well as peer to peer exchange, and also like it or not as a concept, as a business the forging aspect of Nxt, if they can continue to grow and develop, is quite interesting, especially if you have a large number of Nxt, so there is reason to invest in the network and "forge" from there if the platform develops into something of use, which people can build onto , which is the idea, and if the community can reach out and encourage adoption because it provides solutions and profitable opportunites, then yes I can see another crypto doing quite well... does that mean it will dwarf Bitcoin, no... infact I am more inclined to think that the next "big and useful" coin we see will not get its next leg up, until Bitcoin has its next leg up... ie if Bitcoin jumps to $5000 and drags the marketcap up to 60 billionish then I can see coins like Litecoin, Nxt ** etc catching a ride on the coattails  and increasing their marketcaps potentially by several billion+ ......which then would have a knock on effect, money is the ultimate network effect... and those development bounties that are out there would all suddenly have a lot more bang for their respective crypto buck, which means they can spend more on developing more , more marketing etc...
 
Also as Bitcoin becomes more mainstream it is carving the path, and in doing so , doing a lot of the grunt work.. if people do get comfortable with Bitcoin, they are more likely to give another crypto a go that goes for traders/merchants and individuals even the media.
 
I am playing devils advocate here ! and I do think that Bitcoin remains the mothership for now, and most likely for sometime, the network headstart is huge, and so is the headstart for adoption rates, ecosystem, investment rates, public awareness, vested interests, regulations, users, marketcap, etc  but never say never is my moto.

 The other thing is that some Goliath of a corporation could try to give it a go.. one with a huge market share already in a symbotic industry that could evolve a concept and role it out to the masses with their already in place marketing machine and vast funds to throw at it and the masses would lap it up, and not care that it was not decentralised and not care that it was funded by "the usual suspects" that is also possible..

  


**Yes even dare I say it Ripple and fcking Dogecoin because wow

How about Karples just makes a clear statement already. Even if the worst thing possible... they lost/stole everyone's money.... couldn't be worse than leaving everyone in the dark to  speculate on what is happening, and what they think the market will do because of what they think is happening and reacting to ghosts and shadows.... or twitter post deletions.... I guess this is just bitcoin though.

Geez bitcoinbuilder prices now below 0.3

Someone seems to know something

My bet is that Bitfinex wants to break off and be an exchange in its own right. I'm sure that was always the plan.

According to bitcoinwisdom charts, BFX has more than half as much volume as BTSP.

BFX yesterday ~16,000
BSTP yesterday ~ 21,000

anybody having bitcoinwisdom blocked by their internet provider in Germany? it's been blocked for me many days now by O2!

Zyk if you think the Japanese and Slovenians together form an axis of evil then that's the best one I have heard yet.

2-bit did call the fortress announcement early, and he was flamed to hell on reddit...

Gox is freaking out for some reason.

it reakes of FUD, claims to have an internal gox document where he quotes things like setting bitcoin back 5-10 years and being bankrupt at any moment lol

I had Stamp buy set up at 512.51 and it went down to 512.52.   

It was hardly a wall, ffs! Damn.

I am. It is called allet.dat backed up on a 5.25in floppy disk among other places.   My floppy also survived the collapse of First Pirate Savings and Trust, later called Bitcoin Savings and Trust and the collapse of Bitcoinica among other interesting events.

If this 700K+ BTC loss turns out to be true, the bears will first have a say, then when the market figures out that those BTC are gone and consequently cannot be sold expect the "short squeeze" to drive price of Bitcoin in terms of USD to new highs in the 4-5 figures.

Because the market has already priced with a non zero probability there are some real bitcoins in MTGox. Check for example https://bitcoinbuilder.com/. The same phenomenon occurred with pirateat40. People were selling in fear that pirateat40 would pay resulting in a flood of bitcoins hitting the exchanges. This was in the fall of 2012 and we all know what the market did after.

"We were broken into and all the money was stolen" is a standard ruse to cover up fraudulent management.

The break-in may be real (by an accomplice), feigned with faked evidence, or totally imaginary.

With bitcoins it is even easier, of course.

That 2bitidiot story may be false in many ways. It may be "merely" false.  Or the reality may be much worse, and that story may be an attempt by the Brotherhood of Friends of Shrem to cover it up.

If clients can be made to believe that the coins were stolen, they will be mad at Mark but the incident will die there.  There will be no police investigation that could reveal wrongdoings, by Mark or other people.

(After all that happened in the last few years, paranoia should be the norm, shouldn't it?)

"Trading has been disabled"

Yeah... I am just wondering if this explains the Gox stop ?

confirmed

Why would they think that mtgox being insolvent means the price on bitstamp goes down? More likely it was a mtgox insider who was able to withdraw cheap bitcoins and selling them for a huge markup on stamp.

Sue him for what he doesn't have?

From the little I have read, I believe that Shrem and Karpeles were not just two members of the board among many, but were two of the founding members --- which may have been as few as two or three. 

How could people trust the remaining members, who may have been selected and brought in by those two? 

If the honest members of the board could not get the Foundation to expel Shrem and Mark right away, they should have left it themselves.   The current members of the board did not do either, so ...

If the community wants to clean up bitcoin's image, it should dis-authorize the Bitcoin Foundation and start another one, with a different name and with people who were not associated to the BF.

Yesterday I would have agreed, but my opinion has changed and I think this pullback will not go below 530. I would not surprised if we already bounce off 550-560 as there's too much demand right now. We will see $800 within the next 2 weeks mark my words.

You are comparing the demise of an tor drug market to the demise of one of the biggest exchanges with the biggest holdings?

No it isn't. Not even in that perspective, because the sums that are involved with gox are much bigger.
But the more important aspect is the confidence.
Bitcoin is no longer just play money that is run by drug dealers. Currently it is pushed by legal financing. If some drug market goes bust, then it means nothing in the legal field. Investors with legal interests are even happy to see that bitcoin is distancing itself from drug trade.

But when a big exchange goes bust, that is the intermediate link between BTC and $, then the entire system will be questioned. If gox can get away with "sorry, but the money seems to be gone", then people will question what stops the other exchanges from doing the same. After all, there are no repercussions.  
Not to mention that drug dealers/buyers won't be seen talking on TV, how they lost their drug money. But we will see fathers of 3, who will tell their stories, how bitcoin promised them riches, but instead wiped them dry.

It took me a long time to understand the Gox situation, so I am not surprised to see people here in the same stages I have gone through. You have to understand who Mark Karpeles is. Look at his cat videos. This is a man selling a dead parrot. There is no credible buy-out in the making. There are no coins at Gox. He is still in denial, trying to restart the engines on the Titanic after all the lifeboats have launched. The coins are gone. forever. The magnitude of the loss is hard to fathom, but when it does sink in, the realization of how precious and rare bitcoins are starts to become clear.

Denial is a powerful psychological force.  Some things are too awful to contemplate. But who is in denial here, bulls or bears? critics or boosters? This Gox thing has shaken me to the core. We should all question our assumptions. Bears, I don't disrespect you. I just disagree. Bitcoin exhibits anti-fragile characteristics and just experienced a major stress shock and got much much stronger as a result.

Easier to agree with you here. The important question is not yet answered, how will the fall of gox be played out. Will there be a bail-out where gox will be bought and the customers will get what they're owed, or will it just be a bankruptcy with all the money magically disappeared.
The first option isn't easy. It would be a noble act if someone invested so much, just to save the integrity of the market, but it does have it's risks. For instance, what stops another exchange from repeating what gox did and by that nullifying previous attempts to save the integrity of the market? Only solution that I can see, is some kind of an self-regulatory system that will separate trustworthy exchanges from the shadowy ones.
I agree, that right now you can't speculate the future, because there is no solid information to speculate the future on. Fall of gox could be a good way to show integrity and responsibility around bitcoin, but it could also make it lose all of it's existing positive halo.

I am reviewing my thoughts, there are 2 voices in my head now, the first is telling me that there will be small drops but we will go up but the second and strongest one is telling me it is not over and that we will drop further and we will drop even less than 400.

I am trying to convince my self and gather my thoughts but the gox situation is not letting it go, I cant let it go and I am starting to think that we will sink even further... any thoughts ?

I base my argument on experience how people here express themselves and react on different arguments.
It's different from investing into Apple or Google, because people actually built things that matter with these investments. With bitcoin the investments mostly go to mining. In other words to build machines that in the general perspective don't contribute to anything. The problem with bitcoin is that it causes arms race in mining, while the increasing size of the network doesn't actually improve anything. It doesn't improve the speed nor security. Just empty work done and resources wasted for something that could be done with a lot less.
The system did make sense in a time where there were only CPU/GPU mining and no pools, but now it's only a fools game with unnecessary wasting.

People are off their heads gambling on that toxic gox shit! If there was really a silver lining don't you think everyone in the know and there familys would be buying and the price would be 5x higher now??

It's not that easy, I doubt the initial rise if it happens soon will be from new people, you don't read about exchange taking hundreds of millions of users money and sending money to another exchange same day.

If we go up now, it's money from old bitcoiners, noobs might join later if it goes up but them starting it at this moment - I doubt it.

How could they possibly have lost 850,000 BTCs?  

No cold wallet at all?

He done it 99.99%

The joint statement killed the rescue (if one ever was to be effected).

I am no legal expert to be honest, a massive dump could happen but cashing that money out wont be easy...

He reminds me of a scene in delirious when eddie murphy says "Now I'm gonna bend over. And when I do, start fuckin'! Here I go!"

http://youtu.be/egoDQv43hAw?t=2m31s

You're assuming that these people who had massive balances on gox (early adopters, whoever) and were cut off to those overnight are able to put the same funds on other exchanges absorbing that hit I guess

I cant imagine how can people put a price for such things, my freedom and my safety and my family safety has no price, not to mention that my morals doesnt let me do such a thing and only the fact that I wouldn't be able to go to sleep at night knowing that I effected someone's life so bad is more than huge.

I don't know if Mark is a bad person, in fact I dont think so, I think the fact that he covered this up and tried to solve it without telling anyone was brave, but sadly this was the worst decision, he should come clean right away and minimize the damage....

That searching still excuses for Mark and the other heads of bitcoin who covered this up is not helping your cause !

It would be better to hunt those insiders down right when the selling at Gox started...

And where would they trade $20m worth of bitcoin so easily?

Looks like they bought in and have hodl since..... losses are listed as "unrealised" so they haven't sold the BTC yet

He took fees both sides of the trade on BitcoinBuilder.... He made plenty of RealBTC(tm)

I get the feeling the price is being held up and being dumped on by a few people at intervals.

why dont you move on, nothing to see here, we love to speculate as the title of this thread and the name of this sub-forum suggest, and thank you for calling us fucktards.... sir welcome to my ignore list

So on stamp there are 11 000 coins to 500$? I think that guy who sold 2000btc just has not enough coins

What price are you banking on?  $520-ish?  or some other amount?



The ONLY explanation that I can think of is that HE was trying to appear as a GOOD and honest business man... in order that he would inspire investors to have confidence in him and that he was NOT just being a sheister..... ...






I predict 4-5 days at most in this range... then we are going to bust out... and be in the $750 to $850 range... ...  My prediction is based on pent-up demand for BTC...   and also based on the fact that we have largely found out enough facts about GOX in order to adequately understand the range of ramifications...

No one can complain they have been unfairly treated then.

Maybe someone has been quietly liquidating 750k coins

Yet it would have been civilized and polite to tell me exactly in what i was lying or being stupid/ignorant about.
so GFY

Someones messing around with ~3000btc adding and removing walls here and there...

Last hope for Bitcoin: fake buywalls

THEY WON`T PROTECT YOU!!

Their only purpose is to lure suckers in to place their bids above them, when enough bids
have been built, we will get a level lower. slow and painful

There is no such thing as "fake" walls.   

so true.  i just wish there were more honest bears, worthy of respect.  so often the "theses" of "bears" is fabricated, predicated on disinformation, or pure FUD.  it makes it very hard to find actual, useful, bearish analysis.  in fact, i have developed an unfortunate bullish myopia by being innoculated against strong bearish cases by the myriad of weak bearish cases.  i have to constantly correct for my own bull blinders.  

I'll bite and go with Peter Vessenes, my money says he is the first bitwhale to cash out.  

I bet Mark Karpeles is in jail by the end of the year. The Gox stolen coins was an inside job. Filing bankruptcy will only get people looking at this closer. He should have just ran with the coins to a country with no extradition.

Hmmm and I got flamed a few pages back for saying I think someones holding the price up and dumping at intervals...

how much you loose in that Gox s**t hole?


sry for you pal, i guess you have learned the lesson the hard way 

Surely we are here to speculate... MY MAIN point is that we have been made A LOT more aware of what is going on... than we were one day ago... At least NOW we have a bankrupcy filing and an outline of facts and a general direction... before that, we were totally speculating on all kinds of scenarios...... surely, there can still be quite a few scenarios... but at least we are Narrowed down a little bit in the range of possibilities, no?

I AM also thinking that the liquidating of BTC has been going on for months...




I think that it is called leveraging what you have to your best advantage (to the advantage of yourself personally... and damn the rest)  There is no brotherhood... unless you form some kind of team/pool to accomplish an objective for the members on the team as a unit.

That's fine. I hope it prevents newbies entering the market at these conditions.

We should get together and buy an island with bitcoins, call it Satoshi Island and have the currency as BTC of course, use the bitcoin protocol to vote trade etc.. and live happily ever after.

In my opinion, it is highly unlikely that 750,000 BTC were stollen recently.  If a huge sum of coins were stollen, then the theft occurred in 2011 when Gox security was lax and the bounty was much less.  The theives sold these coins in 2011 and 2012, keeping the price repressed and explaining the long bear market at this time.  

Here is my theory in more detail: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=492393.msg5438572#msg5438572

If the coins were not stollen recently and entered the bitcoin economy long ago, then the missing 750,000 GoxBTC is bullish medium and long term, because the effective monetary base of bitcoin just decreased by 6%.  If 20% of those who thought they had coins at Gox, buy new coins (and move them to cold storage this time), that represents 150,000 BTC of sudden demand.  

Right on.

Which appears to be what the "core bitcoin community" desperately wants in the case of MtGOX.  Why aren't they clamoring for a criminal investigation?

Bythe way, it should be easy to find and demonstrate specific instances of use of the "malleate request and get refunded" trick. Perhaps those examples can be found even without the cooperation of MtGOX? Have any such examples been published, or is that still only a theory?

Whats up with the movement the last 3 days? I've never seen this currency stay at the same price for so long really. Explain? For the last months the bots been all over the place (bitstamp for example) and trading/manipulating the price like crazy. Why not now?

EXPLAIN

Why dont they do it in an open way? It would help people trust them and increase business surely?

How would one go about making such an open transparent exchange? What would be the flaws?

I do know he's a douche but if there's some piece of information behind why he's making jokes I want to know.

The P/E ratio is solid in this one...

Why? We may get another crack at some cheap coins. 

I really never understood your posts....

How would open transactions be implemented to current exchanges in your opinion?

Thanks

What is your predictions for summer?

Bitcoin do it already, I don't have time and nerves to wait the whole day, do something already....


BTW watching bitstamp for some time now, bids are going lower, less than 4458 to bring us below $520

Its been pretty stable to $400 & $500 for the last couple of days. I expect bids to increase tomorrow with a little more fiat from Goxed people coming in.

Has anyone already established through which exchange these unaccounted coins were already routed and partially used for market making?

Personally, I would NOT be surprised if there are many discrepancies in various exchanges; however, at this point we would be engaged in a high level of speculation to assume that any discrepancies in other exchanges (such as Bitstamp or BTC-e) rise anywhere near the GOX level of incompetency and/or fraud.

I think you guys sometimes forget people do actually want to buy bitcoins, it's not just traders. There's not always a motive apart from simply buying.

We'll see.

One hour and not a single confirmation. Bullshit.

Breaking News: Mark Karpeles bought Bitstamp!!!

Oh you are right. We are now at 288780

Thanks for clearing that up. We all had no idea.

didnīt bitcoin.info and Karpeles always worked together at the same announcing of announcement page.....and happens when the lead whale crashes on the shore??

Yes, Stamp to Btc-e. I bought some PPC, LTC and XPM but sent BTC there mainly for LTC if it drops.

Never watched the dogecoin charts and Iīm not sure if you are serious about this or not!?

I and a lot of people have coins on stamp too and Iīm worried that stamp could do the same as gox some day. Even though they are at a leading position at the moment.

The most plausible stories about what happened includes MK knowingly trying to drag this thing out since about 2011.. hoping that he would earn back coins that he had lost in 2011 (nearly 1 million coins). 

Accordingly, by the time late 2013 came, MK was utilizing bots and self-dealing with investor coins and well manipulating the whole situation in order to attempt to recover lost coins from 2011.. that he was NEVER able to make up.

What an incredible day!

Really fighting with me if I should buy now (80% of my safements) or not. Made the wrong decision @400īs and will not make another wrong one with buying or not buying.

Yeah all in, that cash is now waiting for 6-8 weeks on stamp to transfered into bitcoins and I missed the good oportunities.

Iīm all in BTC, lets go down now like always :|

Sorry, the joke was too good to pass. 

But you must at least agree that the audits of MtGOX by Ver and of Coinbase by Antonopoulos were pathetic, to put it mildly?

EDIT: removed the double spaces after punctuation.

Is Satoshi cashing out or not? Please advise 

great thing about Satoshi is that he probably wasn't worried about that implication, as much as he was to create bitcoin.

While I agree that LTC should cost more, I think that LTC is even more concentrated and manipulated. Someone is constantly forcing the market with 2mil.$+ buy and sell walls at BTC-E. I bet it's the same guys that run BTC-E, because I really doubt that an outsider would trust this amount of money to the anonymously owned BTC-E

Interesting. I've been waiting on some news to come out so we could judge, based on market reaction, whether we are still in a bear market or not.

Here on the forum the bears are out in full force. But the exchanges have only gone down slightly. This is the kind of semi-neutral news that could be interpreted good or bad, with a slight lean towards bad.

But the exchanges are holding their own so far. If we go up from here, I might reconsider whether this bear market still has legs.

Right. But the two of you are taking up over 50% of the posts. Your enthusiasm about this news is obvious and representative.

WTF are you talking about? Plug is pulled by who?

English please.

Thanks for that, but I was wondering if someone could translate this: "why did they all knew of Mt. Gox being insolvent when the faked 2 bitidiot came out and made patently clear they of course are not " to English?

Let's go down the rabbit hole a bit, shall we? Far enough that we can't climb back out. Have a couple shots of Jagermeister and let this flow over you...

1) The image you posted has SN written as "Dorian S. Nakamto 'shaver'" -- Satoshi is also evil mastermind Trendon Shavers!
2) More interesting fully confirmed evidence: Newsweek says SN's name is Dorian Prentice Satoshi Nakamoto. Dorian PRentice. DPR. Satoshi ran Silk Road.
3) In Japan, Satoshi Nakamoto would be Nakamoto SAtoshi: NSA
4) Nakamoto's brother says Satoshi worked on secret government projects.
5) Revealing anagram for "Satoshi Nakamoto" is "anatomist hookas" -- quite obviously he was interested in the science behind drug paraphernalia and impacts on the body

Satoshi Nakamoto is a retired government agent who headed up the Bitcoin project for NSA, pulled the pirateat40 scam, ran Silk Road, and goodness only knows what horrors he may be perpetrating in the toy train community. Of course this means Ross Ulbricht must be a patsy. I have double-checked this conspiracy theory three times and cannot find a hole in it.

im considering this might be a big publicity stunt for bitcoin and we are instead going up

thoughts?

Monday. Wait until Monday.

droping..we will probably retest 600$

I think that those from wall street who wanted in, are already in. Dreams of bitcoin hitting big at wall street will more probably remain dreams. No serious player will trust their funds into something where he has to hope that unknown Satoshi/drug dealer/computer crackers/confidence men will hold their coins and by that keep the value of bitcoin.
If they want to invest into crypto, then they will start pumping something that has a more transparent history.

As I wrote that it is absurd that we were going up, everybody was bashing on me and was writing "to the moon" 

Now we go down and these morons are silent.

Thanks to your "to tha moon" BS I also get in panic and bought @685 with every money I had (50K). And now Iīm fucked.

No you're not. $685 is a great buy in price to go all in. If you can't handle daily ups and downs like this then investing is not for you.

I bought low today while I was out and sold at same price when I came back hoping I would buy cheaper.  Minute later it's 10$ up. 300$ lost opportunity in seconds. Shit  

That's not the case here. These coins are MtGox's. Parts of it come from the transaction where Karpeles proved he owned them.

looks like the market fears gox coin dumps if they will be repaying with these moving coins

Can't belive poeple are still selling... This is probably the bottom (i hope   ). If nothing else, it was a good day for trading.

I'd much rather see a high volume panic get sold into the hands of whales and bounce back hard than this low volume drift down.

 

Awesome

holy fuck

to me, if someone throws shit in that manner, his intensions are always shady. an honest guy would, in my opinion, act differently. tinfoil hat on: tbi is supplied by someone with an agenda against bitcoin with secret information. for his 5 minutes of fame he decides to do go for it, not knowing the aganda of his supplier.

It's naive to expect people with market clout not to use it. Align your interest with ours at let let power work for you.

No, the last guy didn't lose $900, he got bitcoin...

The money saved on taxes, car license and registration, fuel tax etc. would 'probably' cover double the toll expenses...

Again, how do these people get to work at the moment... is it free? It costs a lot to own a car, the poor people you are talking about sound like they don't even have 2 dollars to rub together and can hardly be compared with people who own cars and have jobs.

Your presuming its the same person ?

naivete at its finest. why did we develop a code of laws to begin with, because everyone is an angel?

Jorge:
http://www.coindesk.com/huobi-ceo-addresses-fake-trading-volume-rumours/

'When I asked him to estimate how much the lack of fees might distort the trading volume, he said that he could easily see a “5-times increase” in trades because high-frequency traders can make profits off of much narrower spreads.

Instead of just volume, Li believes that customers should evaluate exchanges based on their liquidity, depth, and the size of the company. At least these are the metrics that he is measuring Huobi against competitors'

Why do you post here?

You sound like the annoying brat telling a group of smokers how bad it is for their health over and over. What's it to you? Light up or screw off.

yup
its offical.
i drew some lines

It is likely true that I have been giving short shrift to aspects of this topic regarding role of government and/or the equating of government taxes with theft; however, in the past couple of days (or has it only been 1 day?), I have provided several fairly lengthy explanations of my various assertions... and each of my posts speak for themselves in terms of the extent to which I provided justifications therein.  You can easily read each and every one of my various posts.. and judge for yourself. 

However, I suspect the fact that you did NOT appreciate my description of situation 1 and situation 2, then likely you are NOT going to appreciate my other descriptions, which I remain of the position that each of my post is meant to be self-sustaining in the context of the thread. 

You seem to want more of an explanation in places that I feel that already that I have adequately explained.  For example, my outlining situation 1 and situation 2 was to ensure with thread participants on this topic that we are talking about the same thing.. and some posters are trying to equate situations 1 and 2 (including yourself) that in my view should clearly and logically be understood as different... b/c the actor in situation 2 is different from the actor in situation 1 (which makes a very meaningful and material difference).

Maybe you will come to the conclusion that I have NOT adequately explained myself through my various posts or that I have NOT adequately justified the points that I was attempting to make in my various posts.   Or, maybe you are of the opinion that my tone has NOT been kind and gentle enough.  I assure you that I have NO ill feelings towards you or towards anyone else participating in the discussion of this topic; however, as I have repeated, I cannot understand why we continue to discuss this topic b/c it seems that we have each had an opportunity to make our points. Also, as asserted by Octaft, the burden does NOT seem to be on me to explain any further than I already have.

Further, if you want, we can continue our communication regarding this topic by PM - since truly it does seem to be transgressing far afield from the topic of this thread.

Just a little fyi: my mother has worked at Deloitte's for 25 years and suddenly in the last 2 weeks, questions about bitcoin are appearing on their weekly business acumen quiz email sent round the offices... I see this as a sign that word is getting out in the finance world and they are slowly catching on...

This price is getting me bored and angry

We need a revolution! how long people can hodl?...
Can't hodl forever

"Can't rain all the time" Eric Draven