What I don't understand is why we put ANY belief in the graphs.  First rule of investing is that past performance is NOT indicative of future performance (good or bad).

The fall will happen today. India (second largest economy) market fell like 500 points.. biggest in 5 years. Nasdaq and Dow will go down today....

people will want to recover cash by selling something to buy other stocks...(at their lowest price)

highest at peak is BTC...

so be ready in 2 hours for big sells

The are either very ignorant or they really think they are outside of the reach of the USG.  This means nothing, as it relates to USD, if you don't have a MSB license.  To my knowledge, they still don't.  Speculation:  Mt. Gox is going down.  This would be a devastating blow to the Bitcoin economy.  Just looking at the market depth, there is currently ~$18 million in BTC.  And looks like ~$16 million in fiat.  And that's just what's in limit orders.  No telling how much is just sitting in accounts.  Either way, if ~$34 million instantly vanished from the Bitcoin economy, it's going to leave a mark.  Hell, people can't even read a forum post without freaking out.  The panic selloff that would result at the remaining exchanges, would be tremendous.  

Cheap coins anyone?  

stagnation?

Why are we going down?

Why does trading come to an halt so suddenly very often?

We are overbought on most time frames tho.

All these "profit taking", "locking in profits" strategies never work and you will regret when btc trades at $1k
You've been warned.

If you do that you're seriously an idiot. Regardless whether you have a hunch there will be a bitcoin rally, that's something only the biggest idiot would do. You'd beat yourself to death if your plan fails...Maybe people just like to live life on the edge. I like a little risk because traditional investments are too slow for me, so i chose bitcoin. But I'd never take out a loan to invest in something (unless I had insider info or something lol)

And you should believe him; why exactly?

I don't think he's gonna time stamp it for us... but he's not all out.. so why is it people try to troll him as if he doesn't have the required BtC to reap the rewards of to the moon scenarios.

Its not an insult, you guys need to research about this reptile dude b4 even bother reading his post. He was a laughing stock. Then he admitted that he needed help and checked into rehab. None of that is an insult. I'm shocked seeing him back and the same old "i'm loaded, i'm dumping coins" BS.
I truly hope him well.

I'm not about that at all mate. If I believe that a sell off will occur, it certainly we be thanks to me writing some shit on this forum. I believe a large dump at this rather precarious tip will be enough to start some panic selling. Panic is what I will be relying on, because that shit causes people to sell their grandmothers in the hope of not being left behind.

1400 BTC to $1000 on Gox. What do you mean people are cashing out? People are cashing out and buying in all the time ofcourse, but the buyers clearly are dominating over the sellers at the moment.

Be bold and hold, do not what you are told.
Don't sell that virtual gold for mold,
for the cancer that is paper.

And what is BTCCHina's business model? How do they generate revenue?

we had an invitation to a major german venture capital company to present a bitcoin business idea. they had no clue what bitcoin was. so we started to explain it. when it came to the "there will only be 21 million btc ever existing" thing, they said that no economy can be built on just 21 mio pieces. we tried hard to tell them about divisibility. they did not buy it. they asked questions like " but who is setting what divisibility comes in place, who is controlling it ?"

OK, finally I got it. Everybody is just envious because I have $millions and they don't, and I did it in the very coordinated way that never risked the majority of the position, in fact at current prices the remainder of the position is already worth more than the whole of it before divestment.

When you cannot argue against operational excellence, you whine. No whiners will be invited to the inauguration ceremony of my castle, however.

Sorry to be so blunt about it but this seems to be the only realistic explanation for the whinery, am I not right?

I tried elsewhere with no result, so can someone here explain how this can happen -> https://blockchain.info/da/address/1CMMBYkiB3AVXbysaYuFEepSJTVRggFaNm

A friend sent 0.9 BTC to my brain wallet by scanning the QR code in my Blockchain wallet app. Exactly 10 sec later a transaction is made from my brain wallet to an address I cannot identify. As if it automatically forwarded the BTC's. What the heck can I do? It's quite a lot of money just laying on some random address now..

isn't it $20 billion?

Yes most of their job is that : predicting the present.

And 1 USD says you are mainly in bitcoin atm - so what? Nobody here says what they really think, only what their position is, you as well.

DAT SPREAD!

but seriously.. gox api down for 4+ hours?? again?  

My interpretation of those charts:

1. The people who believe that a bitcoin will be worth a zillion in a few years are not in those charts.  They are holding all the bitcoins they have, and whenever they can get or borrow any more money, they immediately buy bitcoins at the current ask price.  Since we do not see much of the latter happening, it means that the believers that remain have largely run out of money.

2. The people who have posted offers to sell (the red "ask" mountain at right) are

   2a. people who bought bitcoins at 900-1200 USD.  They are waiting for the price to return to the same level, so that they can get out without losing money.  Many will probably hold their offers at those levels even if the  price falls off the bottom, because they would ratehr keep hoping for the impossible rather than admit their mistake.  Only very reluctantly they will lower their ask price and accept a loss.   On the other hand, if the price ever returns to the 900-1200 range, the smarter ones will sell out and quit.

   2b. miners and other people people who bought coins at much lower price, and bet that the price still may get up to the 900-1000 range.  They are likely to profit even if they sell well below that, but will try for that level only for greed.  They are likely to lower or raise their ask price as the price moves, and will sell as  the chances of higher prices seem more remote.

3. Most of the people who have posted offers to buy below the current price (the green "bid" mountain at left) do not believe that the price will get much higher than that.  They  are assuming that if the current price is (say) 900 USD, then it will probably remain in the 850-950 range for a while.   So they offer to buy at (say) 850 and wait for the occasional customer who "must" sell a bunch of bitcoins at any price.   Then they immediately post an offer to sell those same bitcoins at (say) 900-950, and wait for the random guy who "must" buy bitcoins at any price.  By repeating this move they could make 5% profit on their capital, several times a week.   However, this strategy only works if they keep their offers to sell at the front of the "ask" queue.  So they will watch the market carefully, and if they see a large number of sellers lowering their ask prices to (say) the 850-950 range, they will immediately lower their bids do buy to 750-850 range.  

Thus:

  A. The mountain of sell offers asking 900-1200 USD cannot be taken as an indication that the market has faith in bitcoin;

  B. The mountain of buy offers which is always 50-100 USD below the current price is not a buffer against a massive drop in ask prices, because it will recede with it.

Does this make sense?

Gox and Stamp are not refusing. There are some very big Players on Stamp, Gox and BTChina that are trying to stabilize the price. They are eating thousands of coins...

Quite possibly.

Probably the tinfoil hat talking but there seems to be a fair amount of trading that's taking a loss to push lower. Long term bear maybe but it coincides with European timezones and Europe could be due some bad news tomorrow:
http://www.irishtimes.com/business/sectors/financial-services/eu-agrees-bail-in-rules-for-deposits-1.1626033

You would have to be blind to not see a huge rally coming. ATH into the new year. 2014 is going to be the year of the Bitcoin and Litecoin

 

Funnily enough, europe is just not there on the bitcoin map!
http://bitinfocharts.com/bitcoin/nodes-active/

Those coins being bought from China has to be sold somewhere else within a month yeah?

So where do you think they will be sold?

Is that total for shorts?

You can "Claim" the BTC once you have gained enough to pay off the loan. No BTC is sold in this case.

When you close position, coints are bought/sold just like they are when you are opening position.

Profit / loss is added/taken from your usd or btc balance.

This wpcs is going to crash when Jan 31 comes when bitcoin hits 200-300

I think it might still go either way, I't hovering around the last top. It looks it could go up but it might as well go down instead.

I remember the other day someone saying something about the possibility of one young gentleman doing a big dump in order to take profits out.

I may be wrong. But I think I may have found a wallet of one prospect huge dumper. Read his last message

https://blockchain.info/address/1AYtnRppWM7tWQaVLpm7TvcHKrjKxgCRvX

Creeping ping-pong on again at MtGox since jan/04 05:00 UTC. Ping stuck at ~880, pong slowly rising. Real bids/asks largely frozen.

I don't see 80k gone today or yesterday from it , but from early December.
Also this is the total amount ever received , not how much was on it.

I smell FUD

https://twitter.com/bitpay

BitPay ‏@bitpay 2m
FAKE Report - BitPay has not been hacked.  We reserve all legal rights for those responsibl

I don't blame Risto for his predictions.  He was basing them on a log-linear line in the growth adoption curve.  He may very well be readjusting that because it appears we are on a much faster growth curve as seen on these charts:  https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=322058.msg4227521#msg4227521

False. People have REPUTATION to gain. Never underestimate how powerful praise can be if you are deemed a demigod of trading (or predict anything ahead of time for that matter). I can give you a very specific, recent, and pertinent example:

 Rpietila said there would be a drop to low 400s in December. I held my fiat and waited. Sure enough, my phone started blowing up with notifications of falling BTC price. I waited, it hit 400, I bought, and it immediately rose hundreds of dollars. I said thank you to Rpietila for his advice. I am now up over 100%. Some fool I am...

for allya ... sufferers

its going up and down, what a mess
it creates for me a lot of stress

It can be for better, it can be for worse
it sort of like riding a horse

I wasted my days by reading a thread
I just want some butter and little of bread

it must come to end, I hope it will do
for now I will hodl, what else can I do?

Thats it! why didn't i think of that 

Hey Goat can you dump 300 coins on Gox for me? K Thanks.

looks like huobi is first to break out of the channel to the upside.

Nah, just a wobble on the way down.  Sources have confirmed this.  充分證實和真實

poeple stop talking chinese, i cant read it

Well, lots of buying all around so either people haven't heard and they are taking advantage of lower pricing or the market doesn't see this as such bad news.

http://hypron.net/bitcoinwisdom.html

The only problem with that is the guy from bitcoinwisdom no longer gets to show his ads, which makes it worthwhile for him to continue to offer the service.

So many bull arguments; so little volume totals.

Dont care about dollar volume. dollar volume combined with X dollars per unit can simplified as Y unit volume. It's always going to be a constant unit volume which has significance to move a market by some percentage.

You can't count bot volume as market volume.
Same with huobi. That is no real volume. With low or zero fees there is allways I high volume, even if there are only 2 bots trading with 0.01 btc.

I encourage anyone to look at the weekly chart. I have looked at ever bubble pop / crash / bounce since the beginning and have noticed that anyone you sells above the 7 week moving average post bubble pop bounce CAN REBUY THEIR POSITION for less that they sold for if not substantially less at a later time. Look at the chart yourself. If you sell here don't lose sleep that the train will take off without you.

I concur ... it is a way to make UK seen to be 'progressive' and hip-tech by encouraging financial innovation, yet at the same time keep bitcoin at arms length.

Private currency it is I think. Switzerland is going the same way, albeit "foreign currency" classification. Bullish overall i'd say.

http://news.slashdot.org/story/14/01/17/0326217/us-government-to-convert-silk-road-bitcoins-to-usd

Interested to know how they gonna do this. I'd very like to buy cheap coins from the US Gov

Unfortunately they aren't stupid.  They won't sell them all on a single day.  My guess is 2600 lots of 10 btc sold over 2 months.

If a big lot will be very useful to find out whether the whales are paying over or under the odds.   Given the publicity around this and the relatively small number ($22 mill)  I will lean towards over.  It would not be a good look if these went for $12 million if the current market price holds.

Different story with 126k coins because that is starting to be real money.

I hope everyone noticed the irony in that "petition".


Perhaps because Dogecoin is what Bitcoin should have been?

There are a number of economic reasons that make me skeptical about Bitcoin's chances of success.  But there is one reason that makes me wary of it: the fact that its is being "marketed" more as an investment than a payment system.

Here is what a true Bitcoin believer, pure of heart, should be saying:

  * Our goal is cheap, easy, unrestricted international payments;
  * We will succeed if everybody uses uses crypto, we will fail if no one uses it;
  * Other cryptocoins are welcome and we hope they prosper.
  * Our hope is that SOME crypto will succeed; it doesn't have to be Bitcoin.
  * We do not know how much a Bitcoin will be worth, and it does not matter.
  * However, the value of a cryptocoin should be as stable as the dollar's value is now.
  * The sooner the price stabilizes, the better.
  * Hoarding or speculating with cryptocoins is evil as it defeats those goals.
  * Large cryptocoin-based financial institutions are just as evil as dollar-based ones.
  * Our priority is to convince merchants to accept crypto as payment method.
  * People should change dollars for crypto only if and when it is is clearly worth it.

Instead, here is what Bitcoin enthusiasts seem to be saying, here and in other forums:

  * Our goal is to get rich.
  * We will succeed if Bitcoin's value rises to the Moon, fail if it goes down to cents.
  * Other cryptocoins are unwelcome competition and we must speak out against them.
  * Our hope is that BITCOIN succeeds, we will be mad if some other crypto crushes it.
  * One Bitcoin must be, and surely will be, worth at least 1000 USD.
  * The price should keep rising in the long run so that Bitcoin hoarders can have a steady income.
  * Large price oscillations are good now because one can make money or grab more Bitcoins.
  * Hoarding and speculating with Bitcoins is what the thing is all about.
  * Large cryptocoin-based institutions are welcome because they will want to push the price up.
  * Our priority is to convince everybody to change all their dollars for Bitcoins and hold them fast.
  * People should pay for things and services with Bitcoins even if it is not worth it.

That unfortunatey is the mindset that fuels bubbles and Ponzi schemes...  

I understand that eBay will allow buy/sell cryptocoins ads, but will not use Bitcoin themselves.

How much will it cost to place an ad in that section?

That Classified Ads section will probably be a very slow and very inefficient cryptocoin exchange.  

Is there trade in other commodities going through eBay?

[edited for typos]

Yes, according to the chart we should be much lower right now ($200ish), reaching $1,000 some time in October-November 2014.

Certainly long term bullish but downward pressure for now.

No one cares about Doge. The only time I ever hear about it is when someone on the forums feels compelled to paste it everywhere. Lets keep this thread dedicated to Bitcoin price, please. We are supposed to only post technical charts and discussion.

Bear market ends after Bitcoin has well undershot the 200 day EMA and has started to move back above it.

We are sill well above the 200 EMA. Infact, it would take a 60% drop in price to hit it as things currently stand, but if the last two Bitcoin crashes and post crash correction periods are anything to go by, hit it and indeed undershoot it we most certainly will.

Eh? What charts are you looking at!?

The ones I am looking at show both July 2013 and also October 2013 (Silk Road take down) as being points when daily 200 EMA was undershot, with the July 2013 200 EMA breaking signalling the end of post April crash correction period and the October 2013 incident being a freak panic event.

It's easy to see that this is an attempt to cause panic just before the 31 Jan.

Why? Because things are looking so bullish the instigators know that come that date there will be no opportunity for snatching any more coins in a panic sell!  

Just hodl! Remember how many refused to sell over the past weeks, and how the price was supported through bits of bad news etc. Now there's not even that as an excuse!

Don't feed the trolls your coins!  

Chart please

Not really. This asshole is paying the fee to himself.

4 days here, still no sight of my munie 

this is crashing

I can't believe people now actually start dumping. Wtf? There is nothing but positive news. Day after day. And what do they do? They start selling.

This is just pure speculation....
But could it be possible that the sell out down to 105 on BTCe could possibly be a mind game with the intent to remind all the speculative traders to put more orders in to buy coins? The net effect being that there will be a lot more buy orders on the books because of this, thus increasing confidence on the buy side of the order book and potentially creating price pressure to make the price go up?

For example, personally I trade very little, I keep my coin off the exchanges unless I am doing a bit of buying here and there,  but I haven't ever really put in a bunch of wishful thinking low buy orders, now I am considering it! Would a lot more buy orders on the order book even at lower / ridiculous levels raise the price of bitcoins?

It makes me laugh to think some of you actually think bitcoin is important enough to be attacked by the gov or the banks or the NSA. Please. Bitcoin is still a pimple on the butt of the world.  

This "attack" is just some stupid hacker getting his rocks off. Hackers hack coders code and bit makers make bots. This will only make bitcoin stronger.

They aren't buying bitcoin (yet) for the same reason people kept their funds at Gox. They didn't see or didn't pay attention to the signs. I took about a 15% hit getting the last of my money out. The price premium was an ominous indicator. Many people didn't race for the lifeboats on the Titanic, either. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Normalcy_bias

I am really  thinking about getting fiat to the gox right now

yea this keeps happening... how are they pumping so much money

That may actually be true true, like "Pigs will fly when they grow wings".

Where did Gox found fiat to buy?

So either gox isn't filled with liars, or they have made so much money they might actually be able to pay out.

I like these options.

Risto believes we still have another month and a half for the bottom to play out... just saying

THIS is the only scum worth mentioning!
*blah blah blah

True


You don't give any arguments.  All you seem to be saying is : "I don't see the value in BTC, and I think markets are saturated".

Jorge is about to become btctalks new enemy no.1
HE SAID BAD THINGS ABOUT OUR SAVIOR!

Come on guys, isn't this a little harsh?

What are you basing all this on? The FUD being spread by 2013-2014 users about mtgox being insolvent?

Mtgox has had quite a few fuck-ups throughout the years, but they have always refunded users and mtgox even bailed out other hacked exchanges. The amount of money they have made in fees is likely hundred thousands of BTC. I just don't see how they can be insolvent at this point.

Some incompetence, or maybe just stubbornness of Mark to do all the programming himself? I don't know, but I can't really hate him for it. As long as I am given my BTC within a reasonable time (few weeks) I don't really see an issue. Friends of mine received fiat withdraws this year. It doesn't scream scam to me, just a lot of trouble, maybe a CEO who can't handle it all.

But calling for somebody dropping him dead, wishing him ill etc is really not the time, if he end up scamming / not giving back funds then fair enough, but too soon imo.

I think this will blow over within the next few weeks, when bitcoin withdraws are enabled and the mtgox price is sky high again everybody will be happy again (except those doing stupid trades right now).

I'm buying with both hands on gox, we should cheer Mark for gifting us these very cheap bitcoins.

I'm attacking those of you who make people believe MtGox could have likely lost a 6 digit BTC sum over the malleability issue (because that's what it would take to make them insolvent).

They generally do not spend their accumulated BTC. I know only of two expenses, the bitomat exchange bailout and the bitcoin foundation donation.

Here is an example of their past earnings, and they have been in business since 2010:

As far as I know, Mark Karpeles is the sole owner of Tibanne Ltd. and Mtgox Ltd.

No idea. Even if it was the case, you think he will spend it all on frappucinos and apple pie rather than make users whole?

Why do bitcoiners still refer to MtGOX as "the main bitcoin exchange", or even as a bitcoin exchange at all? For sentimentalism? For personal friendship? Because Mark is "one of us"?

Actually - allowing limited withdrawals makes sense - they must fear a 'run' on BTC either crashing the exchange (with it's new software fix being untested, too) - or meaning they have so little liquidity that their business is finished.

Allowing 'some' withdrawals will mean people wish to hold BTC instead of Fiat, which will inflate the price on Gox, and at this point, some people might decide to stay.

If Gox is clever, it will still have a business left.   Don't get me wrong - I will be the first in the queue to get out, but it is a logical solution.

I did think this was their only logical way out (assuming they really do intend to stay in the game).

You already know that I am totally ignorant on how bitcoin works, and too old to learn; so forgive me for asking:

1* How many weeks does it take for the network to process a transfer of a few thousand bitcoins from MtGOX's cold wallet to MtGOX's hot wallet? 

2* How many such transfers from the same wallet can the network handle per month?

3* If bitcoins were transferred into a wallet using certain custom software, can they be transferred out using a different software?

4* If so, how much would MtGOX have to pay for a software that they could use to process the pending withdrawals, while they fix theirs?

Wait a minute. I was a BBS user back in the time of 300bps modems. Emoticons were invented in the mid 80's, so your statement is technically false.

 

Well, you don't usually move address if you are insolvent, so either downsizing or upsizing.

So, in that aspect bitcoin trading is indeed a classical Ponzi schema: the money invested by new members is used to pay the large profits of the early joiners -- if these are smart enough cash out while the price is higher than what they paid for their coins.  The net effect of the game is to shift money from the late entrant' pockets to those of the early entrants.

It is not dishonest if people know it is a zero-sum game with uncertain odds, before they join.

japanese police is investigating mtgox. that´s why mk is talking strange stuff. they were forced to move out. japanese government will declare bitcoin illegal in japan. insiders know it, dump their coins for any price, since they know they get the dollars after investigation/dissolving of gox is over.

confirmed. confirmed. confirmed. confirmed. confirmed.confirmed.

2 days news full of bullshit

Say hello to my ignore list full of FUDer + i'll not coming to the 1K party since you no seem really  trustworthy

Holy Macaroni Guys!

WTF!!

You n00bs need to step away from the SpamSell button.

Seriously, 10 more minutes until 7PM Gox Time?

But, will it yield result?

You'd think PR & Legal are hobbling *something* together... anything!

(2 weeks?)

what are you talking about, dude ? this is obviously just fun. don´t take it personal.

sarcasm(sarcasm(x)) = x
sarcasm(sarcasm(sarcasm(x))) =  

I'm lost.

Did bitstamp ever support deposits through bitinstant?

Verify Account

    Customer ID:xxxxx
    Status:Verified

Two-factor authentication
Enabled
Two-factor authentication is enabled.

Bitcoin Withdrawal
You are not allowed to withdraw bitcoins at the moment.

Dunno why people are insinuating that people are trying to spread FUD saying that they have been stopped their btc withdrawals from stamp.


How many people do you need to report the same thing before you beleive it.

Oh here's my proof (check the date and time)

I am calling BS. My withdrawal (several thousands of dollars) has been pending since 16th february. All Bitstamp did was sending of KYC questions on 18th. Since then NOTHING. And no I can´t use the money for trades either, they are just floating in limbo right now.

Yes, agree with you. There were several posts saying "Stop spreading FUD", and you wanted to make clear it's not FUD.

Like I said, my withdrawal just went through, but I believe you when you say yours didn't.

OK, again, here is what I would do if I had to safely store several hundred thousand bitcoins that my clients gave me for safekeeping. 

First, I would create a dozen new addresses and distribute the bitcoins evenly among them.  I do not believe in trapdoor functions, and I know what NSA did to that random number generator; so I instead of any "modern" encryption I would use the old and guaranteed one-time-pad method. I would generate a file of truly random bits (say, extracted from the microphone signal), and XOR it with the private keys.  Then I would copy the result to a pen drive, check that the copy succeded, safely remove the pendrive (see, I learned my lesson!) I would repeat with a second pendrive and give it to my partner.  Then each of us would go to a different bank, on separate cars, and store his pendrive in a safe deposit box. Only then I would go back and reformat the hard drive of my computer.


Do I really need to add the "stupid smiley" here?)

I like his calmness in explaining his stance

I feel like an awful troll for saying this, but am I the only one who feels no sympathy for the goxers? They had forever to stop using them, why did anyone have money in there?

Bitstamp is offline for me..

blah blah blah....

Hahaha, the very same thing was said about the people that bought back in April 2013 at 266$. And they could realise some nice profit a few months later.
Yeah do that, wait until bitcoin hits 100$ again, which never will be the case, and watch bitcoin climb to 2000$, 3000$, one day to 10000$, and maybe then
you'll realize that you'd be waiting forever to get your cheap coins.

Why is there so much tolerance to dishonesty in the bitcoin community?

to be honest, sometimes I think people doesn't even read previous posts, I am not implying that I know things but I am reminding you people this is the Speculation sub-forum dont be so offended with predictions...

Good morning there, I didn't sleep till 04:00 Europe time (GMT+1). and just woke up, watching Bitstamp now,so the price went up to 646 !!...how do we translate this?

something worth mentioning is that the MACD is still negative: the 12 period AMA is above the 26 period AMA, there will be a cross over in few hours and the price may drop.

only now it seems that a reversal is possible, the next drop will decide if we continue going down , or if there will be a rally up, of course the Gox situation will complicate things a little bit..

I don't think we will ever know what was the lasting effect on BTC price of that 10,000 BTC sale on Bitstamp. for almost 6 million dollars.

As I understand it, the effect mostly depends on how much money and how many coins entered or left the "active bitcoin market", the sum of the working budgets of all day traders and other short and medium-term speculators.  That excludes money in the bank, and coins in private wallets, whose owners do not intend to use for frequent bitcoin trading.

From the way the sale happened, I would guess that the seller of those 10 kBTC will not be using those 6 M$ for further bitcoin trading.  On the other hand, at least some of the buyers must have been speculators who bought off their working budgets. Therefore, there must have been a net loss of money from the active bitcoin market, amounting to some fraction of those 6 M$.  By itself, that would tend to bring the price down.  However, the opposite conclusion would hold if the seller were to put all that money into active trading, and some of the buyers were new investors lured by his offer.

I would also think that those 10 kBTC probably were not in the active market before, and now some of them are.  (That round number points to a cold stash, rather than someone's working BTC budget; and It seems unlikely that all the buyers were "hodlers".) Thus the number of BTC in the active market probably increased, and this too would tend to bring the price down.  However, the opposite conclusion would hold if the seller was an active speculator, and at least some of the buyers were "hodlers".

As we saw, the sale had a large effect on the price while it was going on; but that immediate damage was quickly repaired by the market in few minutes (as it usually is).

However the sale probably will have more persistent negative effect, as discussed above.  This effect will not be visible in the price charts; the price will just increase more slowly or decrease faster than it would have done if the sale had not taken place.

Generally it goes in so called "waves", which means that it will next hit 500. This enables the experienced traders to make money on the markets at the expense of the inexperienced.

500 maybe not, i am thinking 530

Secondmarket
Winkelvii
Some of the SF-area VCs?
edit: Paypal would be awesome, but a bit unrealistic

What most of you seem to not understand is that one of the biggest results of this Gox fiasco is that many many coins are going into encrypted jump drives and paper wallets. They are not Beany Babies. They are Faberge eggs. There are going to get scarce. Really scarce.

I'm pulling most of my holdings off the exchanges. I should have done it long ago. You can figure out for yourself what this will do to the price.

Of course it is OK to buy coins on other exchanges from the exchange's customers and withdrawing them.

What is not OK is buying a big lump of those coins in private from the exchange without the clients' knowledge.  

I don't understand why ANY of you here would still have funds on mtgox. Mtgox has had blatant liquidity and management problems and been the running joke of this community for almost an entire  YEAR. I removed my funds in AUGUST. We had passed mtgox off as no longer relevant and a facade months and months ago and now suddenly it's a big deal again?

What? 

Not sure yet, but i possibly got goxxed out of ~6 real btc by bitcoinbuilder

had ~3 real btc on withdraw 15 hours ago and they are vanished, contacted the support and they "dont see it in their history".

Also sold some goxbtc for ~3btc but these 3btc never appeared in my balance.

So in total about 6real btc vanished somewhere, no help from the support so far.

I have deposited some real btc to them, yes

Got an email









Rofl this is pure theft, i just lost a bunch of btc.

Is this thing fucking BULLISH

http://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/1z37zw/mt_gox_has_at_least_200k_btc/

Please, clear it to me.

Is this thing fucking BULLISH
http://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/1z37zw/mt_gox_has_at_least_200k_btc/
Please, clear it to me.

The wallets belonging to Gox that people have found so far (containing about 550k BTC) have not been touched since 2011.

I am talking about a case in which the private keys have been lost, in which case 750k BTC has been taken out of the total money supply. If they have been stolen (but the keys are still known) it shouldn't have much of an affect.

the guberment have their tricky paws on this...

Personally, I am NOT too worried about the MT. Gox situation in the whole scheme of things - however, it is leaving some uncertainty for some time b/c we are NOT getting very clear communication about the extent of the damage and/or the extent to which any investors will be made whole.     Certainly with the passage of time, more and more regular people are finding out about bitcoin.. and there becomes more and more potential for bitcoin to begin to fill some various voids and to take on the value of various asset classes in the forum of currency, commodity, money transmitter, and network - amongst other potentialities.

He filed up for bankruptcy. It was accepted by the jury and now legal and financial investigation starts. The debt is circa 6.4bn Y and the assets of MtGox is circa 3.84bn Y. That's a relief

But this also means they have to liquidate their remaining coins FIRST, if any left?

http://falkvinge.net/2014/02/28/the-gox-crater-crowd-detectives-reveal-billion-dollar-heist-as-inside-job/

If the market was rational, this would be extremely bearish.

Maybe they had all their coins at empty gox?

lol, agreed

It shits me how everything is always 'priced in'

China laws? ... no worries, priced in!
Russia ban? ... are you kidding, priced in!
Russian unban?!! ... told ya mate, priced in!
Mt Gox crash? ... too easy! priced in!
Mark K detailed at airport with 750K coins in paper wallets ... you guessed it!

Im exaggerating obviously but you get the point.

try to wipe your ass with Bitcoin.....and you´ll see cash is king

Bitcoin do it already, I don't have time and nerves to wait the whole day, do something already....


BTW watching bitstamp for some time now, bids are going lower, less than 4458 to bring us below $520

At least I try

So bitbulls believe that they will become even wealthier with support from wallstreet traders?

Yes I have heard quite a bit of Alan Watts presentations...     Some of you guys may need to read economist richard wolff to get some perspectives on labor history and to get a sense of our modern state of affairs and the exploitation of the people by capitalists (my employment of the word capitalist does NOT mean I am against capitalism).

I think deep down in their hearts they already begin to feel that the triumph of bitcoin can't be stopped. It's a battle they're destined to lose.
So they start trolling and spreading misinformation. Classic!

http://coinfire.cf/2014/06/30/breaking-usms-auction-winners-notified/

A verified source with the USMS who wishes to remain anonymous stated to Coin Fire, “It is really important that we get this 100% right. We have to verify that they aren’t tied to any sort of criminal activity, we have to verify we have the money from the wire transfer. If we send the coins we understand we will have no way to reverse the transaction so every step is being taken.”

Still not to be considered as a viable option for big amounts teh only way we are going to get rid of these thefts, robberies and scams is the following

https://bitsquare.io/

I don't see many other options today unless we are able to move money p2p (using escrow)

Greed is the best motivation for succes. And i will succeed.BTC21 ftw!

Online computer are never safe(just think about the recent Windows Defender remote hole). Use an old pc, which you never connect to the internet. Or just buy a Trezor. Much easier this way.

Ok. I'll admit yours is better advice. I'm just not into hardware wallets for now. (My computer is essentially a large hardware wallet; but that's another story.)


I don't trust anything.

Also, the news media articles are not mentioning Bitcoin or playing it down as the ransom payment method. Hell one article on CNN listed the ransom payment in dollars only.

I fully believe this omission on the part of the media is by design. But not for the reason that they "don't want to villify Bitcoin" or "don't want to associate Bitcoin with the bad thing" that everyone believes.

It's because they don't want to help spread awareness of Bitcoin to more Average Joes as being more valuable than fiat currency, and they want to continue to control the narrative surrounding Bitcoin.

Which ones are missing?  Can you list them in order that we can better understand who are and who are NOT ?

Sometimes, missing does not mean that they are opposed, it could mean that they are either neutral or don't want to publicly state their position, if they have one.

And you're real heroes  

Anyway don't put your eggs in the same baskets.
I mean come on everyone likes euros and dollars too. Being rich in btc is great but taking a slight bit of the profit you make and put it in dollars can't hurt anyone

This way if it IS a bubble you won't be completely fucked.

It really seems like a bot is constantly buying, like with Mt Gox. But I wonder if that is the case, or it is just general buying pressure from new investors.

i have to walk to the local bank on a daily basis (part of my job). there are beggars sitting on the sidewalks. i always gave them change. since december, when price rise started to accelerate i decided to give em more as long as bitcoin is rising. not long ago i had to start handing out € 5 notes which raised some eyebrows. last week i switched to € 10 notes. they must really wonder what kind of freak i am, because next week i will start with € 20 bills and if this sucker keeps rising there are still € 50 and € 100 bills. not sure what price level must be reached until i pull out the € 500 bill. but i am commited.  

Congratulations - enjoy the well earned BTC =)

The bitcoin market has never taken money from me besides the occasional transaction fee and whatnot, so I can't even imagine what it would feel like buying a $2800 bitcoin and the price immediately going to $2000, but I'm sure that guy is in this thread somewhere.

Now that's a fine perspective:

I am really thinking about selling some BTC (what I have never done before) when we start pumping again.

Only to buy again after the price correction / small crash afterwards.

If I only knew there the top was ... :-/

Cryptocurrency is a giant rat trap designed to ensnare your money and prevent you from being able to access it.  Every single one of these exchanges is like this now, and since Bitcoin is not the unit of account of anything, it's value is entirely derived from it's ability to convert to fiat:

Why shall we panic? There's no reason to do so. Everybody knows the market is going for $3000+.
So what is happening now is just ahealthy pullback, shaking out the noobs and weak hands.

When there are big price moves, sometimes people get a little paralyzed and they do not put money back on the order books, so the order books become somewhat thin.. therefore the price continues to move alot once it started to move and there continues to be disagreement about the price.  Sometimes this will settle down and then becomes a bit more difficult to get it to move and the order books fill up too.

Or, you know, you could always just say that you got your bitcoin from Mt. Gox. Or from Cryptsy. Or from [insert any other exchange that disappeared here]. How would they know otherwise?

Place your bets on the bitcoin head and shoulders:

why am i not surprised...

i see nothing has changed here in bitcoin land.

No. They signal their intent to signal for segwit2x.

(And segwit2x users are supposed to signal for segwit. Let's hope they follow through.)

A bit nitpicky perhaps, but at this point it's kind of imporant to be particular about it, since most of the concern regards stalling the upgrade.

In retrospect, even my hindsight is bad. Who waits years and years for an insane pump, gets one, and let's it slip away without taking profit? Hodling is a habit that's really hard to break. 

To my understanding a fixed number of blocks needs to be found before it "locks"
See: https://www.xbt.eu/

The fact that a $40B network is now running on BTC1 should give everyone pause for concern.

By that definition "we" only applies if you run your own node.  I suspect there are not many "we" here.

Hi guys. I have a question about exchanges supporting both coins in case of a split...

Douring the BU fiasco, a bunch of big exchanges pledged that they would support both coins... (www.cryptocoinsnews.com/18-bitcoin-exchanges-say-theyre-ready-for-a-bitcoin-split)

So my question is, does this agreement still stand and does it mean that customers will receive both coins or does it just mean that they will allow trading of the second coin?

With 86.8% now and F2pool on board since a little while, only one big trolling by some big pool would avoid lock-in in a few hours.

P.S.: Segwit2x (intention) is now at 97.9%. With that majority I don't really care if they do a hard fork to 2MB. In fact I am in favor of it. JUst don't ever mention the aberration of BU next to me.

UPDATE ON ATH ATH ATH ATH GAME                LAAAAAAAAAST CALLL             LAAAST CHANCE FREE    BTC      BETS WITHIN 24 H, NO BETS TAKEN ANYMORE AFTER 21/07 23:22 (CET)

Didn't forgot anybody?
What to win?
ATH BTC date = 0.25 BTC + 0.25 BTC EXTRA for a specific reason why this date!

****ATH by bitstamp****

20/07 Siggy
21/07 Mr Frog
22/07 Protokol
24/07 Lost_in_base
26/07 Globbo
31/07 Infofront

02/08 Steelboy
03/08 D_eddie
04/08 Bitserve
05/08 Bikerleszno
06/08 Last of the v8s
07/08 Pajulapoiss
10/08 Machasm
19/08 Elwar
28/08 Vamos1

09/09 Edgar
11/09 Buwaytress
15/09 MinermanNC
17/09 Spaceman_spiff

01/10 K.Ehleyr
04/10 Herman Hesse
13/10 Cryptoqueen

12/12 Kurious
23/12 Fractaluniverse

Greetz, your Bitcoin sponsor                                   

I only wish that I had been more zealous when I started dabbling in cryptocurrencies. If I had invested only a fraction of what I was willing to risk at blackjack over the years instead of chump change, I'd be looking at 6 or 7 figures of value rather than a paltry 4 figures. The saying, "rather be safe than sorry" just does not ring true right now for me. I've been safe and now I'm sorry.  

If viabtc begins trading ABC (http://bitcoinist.com/viabtc-begins-trading-bitcoin-cash-bcc-for-chinese-yuan-cny-in-anticipation-of-uahf/) does this mean that there will be HF chain split at 1 Aug? In that case, the drop of price will continue indefinitely and Jihan Wu will curse the day he made that shit  

It is my opinion that a PoW change should be devised, engineered, tested and put in the code ready to activate. Activation should not involve any kind of miner support, of course. It should on the contrary assume miners will fight back.

The new PoW should have suitable tweakable parameters. Certain choices for parameter values would basically leave the PoW as it is, and other choices would be more disruptive. There should be signaling to get a feel for the available hashpower with different PoW's/parameter choices.

If the machinery works well enough, this could become the weapon that will never have to be used.

Just clarifying for the sake of truth. Depending upon the sequencing of things, Bitcoin Cash may be no more altcoin than is SegWit coin (which is somewhat playfully starting to be referred to as Bitcoin-Jr)

Maybe you don't believe the blocksize increase will happen? I hope it does, because:
- Even if not right now, we will need that blocksize increase sometime in the future.

Much like Nigel's relabeling of '10' as '11', SegWit accomplishes its block size magic by mere dishonest accounting trickery.

if you cannot will not spend a little bit of money to help this network,  you have no business in its faith, so PISS OFF!

its not about distributing the blockchain to everyone.
its about allowing everyone to participate in it.

no offence intended, i worded that rather harshly :S

Price is going lower again
What happend?
Small dropp i know But just asking Why aint we going forward

I've seen all kinds of stupid explanations on these forums for what constitutes "decentralized".  The current bitcoin core explanation is basically "the ability to run a node".  Lol?  Then you got Adam and the 400 MB block gang who didn't even bother to come up with some type of poorly constructed defintion.  In reality, it's the ability for people to mine the coins directly which requires commodity off the shelf mining hardware - meaning the network is currently completely centralized.  Therefore, anyone who actually cares about decentralization would be campaigning for a PoW change to GPU, otherwise there's no reason for bitcoin to exist.

Thanks!

Looking the catalog and prices of those sites. Not gonna buy anything just now... but I probably will when Bitcoin moons before end of year

ANyway... I don't believe in this shit as an investment but I think a 1KG silver bar would be a great collectible/decoration. Any reason most 1KG bars are UGLY AS FUCK? Why can't they even polish them properly?

@Elwar: Good for me I have always considered silver to be nicer than gold (maybe I have something against yellow, donno). Noone would bother to fake silver... Not worth it I guess.

P.S.: This jmbullion doesn't seem to ship outside the US. I am in SPAIN. Any other site recommendation?

More questions... Why some silver bars of the same weight have a price difference of like 15%???

Ie: THis one https://silvergoldbull.com/100-oz-royal-canadian-mint-new-style-silver-bar vs this one https://silvergoldbull.com/100-oz-johnson-and-matthey-vintage-silver-bar

Are we all going to die??

The poeple who is against bitcoin doing there best to stop the growth of iT.

So Whats up with bips141 almost locked in..

123 blocks remaining, if its locks in is that better for the btc beceause of that bips141 is the real
SegwitX2..

Conclusions? Explanes?

Sorry for my english if its bad.

Kraken??

Poloniex

Wait for the shit storm..

as for the fort, the simplest option is to withdraw to a paper wallet. send the bitcoins elsewhere after the fork and then use the private keys for bitcoin cash.

There is no fucking scenario on this planet in which metals don't skyrocket because they are the Schelling point when debt based currencies blow up.  You can live in some alternate dimension pontificating on some random bullshit Nick Szabo said, but none of that changes this objective reality that will occur.  Stocks are also garbage in this paradigm because they're mostly based around infinite consumer growth as well, but the govt may or may not manipulate that market to whatever number they choose before it all blows up.

Something between a few months to 24 months is probably pretty accurate.  All I know is, unless they manage to kill everyone on the planet with nukes, the Yids aren't going to be able to contain silver and it's going to make me a lot of money.

There isn't a chance that ver or wu will give you wealth in exchange for your bcc. Nobody is giving anyone wealth for bcc.  Everyone will keep their bitcoin wealth.

How do they pump?

What miner in their right mind will mine BCC peanuts for 3 months?

Those of you planning to trade the new altcoin for bitcoins, be careful not to harm your privacy in the process.

I, personally, think Bitcoin Cash is an elaborate scheme to link otherwise mindful bitcoiners to all of their addresses.

Take the necessary precautions.

i just wait patiently to sell the bitcoin cash right after the spit. do you know any exchange to do so ?

By Szabo's definitions if you are unsure about bitcoin/bcc's future then you should diversify... (self.Bitcoin)

This means if you are unwilling to selling half your bitcoin equity for bcc then the strategy you have chosen is that bitcoin will win out. This goes for r/btc'ers and anyone claiming to favor bcc.

Sitting on only a proportion of bitcoin and airdropped bcc is not a proper vote for being unsure of the outcome. If you don't at least split your equity, whether you admit it or not, your strategy is heavily weighted towards bitcoin

if you give bch a .01% of victory I don't really consider that uncertain.  Uncertain in this sense implies 50/50. Regardless the optimal strategy is to converge the future winning coin as fast as possible as its determined.  

Those that converge on the winning coin first have the most to gain or not to lose

Segwit turned into "sellwit" just like it did for Litecoin on release date.  Ironcially, both were probably pumped by the exact same Chinamen.

But both are two different chains by now so even if there's not enough transactions in Bitcoin, people wanting to move their BCH would probably amount to much more than 1MB in BCH chain.

And of course, most people are retards and didn't move their coins to Kraken, Bittrex and ViaBTC even though they had weeks to prepare. So we might have yet to see real volume.

Can you check the history tab of the electron cash wallet and maybe PM me a screenshot? Let me take a look at it. Also, if there are any sent transactions, right click it and click "details" and share the screenshot in PM. Thanks.

Have a look here it a photo from the wallet:

EDIT: i send August 1 and August 2 1 btc on each transaction. By that time the fork has happened

thank you so far!!! at the incoming addresses i had 2. and i exported those priv keys. do i need to export something else??

Ok guys, with Bitcoin reaching new amazing heights this is where I go insisting again in that everyone of you that didn't already have a hardware wallet buy one. It's only like.. uhhh... 0.02 or 0.03 BTC. And it will be the best purchase you ever made with your BTC.

Buy it, try it, use it. You won't regret it.

P.S.: I am in no way affiliated with any of the hardware wallet companies, I even paid for mines.

Yesterday, they sent a mail about this and a firmware update. They state that the device must be physically opened... . ?

Paper wallets are vulnerable at any of the following moments:

- When created: Private key generation vulnerability or PC compromised.
- When redeemed: PC compromised.

They are also vulnerable in case of physical compromise during storing.

It seems the security vuln in Trezor firmware would also require physical access plus a not so simple firmware update with a hacked firmware to get access to private key.

Anyone concerned about potential physical exploits should go Ledger way. The secure element is a great enhacement in that aspect.

Well, that is somewhat safe. But I still don't see the advantage in security over a hardware wallet while I see the less convenience in usage.

...in further non-news today, Bitpay lied again https://blog.bitpay.com/bitcore-segwit-activation/

No lies here.
The Blockstream Satellite project is supposed to broadcast the One True Chain, correct?
The Blockstream Satellite project sources this One True Chain from the relay network, correct?
The relay network is a high speed backchannel whose primary purpose is to tie all miners together directly in a low latency network free of hops through non-mining nodes, correct?
You really can't connect these dots?

Try giving the nazi salute or giving someone the middle finger in Germany and see how far that gets you.

If there was a significant switch of hashrate from BTC to 2x or bch such that it caused BTC to stall for a significant time, couldn't core implement something similar to bch where the diff adjusted down quicker to compensate? If so shouldn't they be thinking of that now just in case this scenario plays out? Or is this unacceptable for some reason?

How are improvements/changes made to BTC without hard forking?
Are there certain criteria set in stone that cannot be altered without forking? I guess tinkering with the diff retargeting is one of them.
Is there something I can read to help me understand what can and can't be changed without a fork so I can stop asking stupid questions on the forum 😊?

Traders never cease to amaze me! When it was clear that BCH will appear, BTC will continue to exist as 'bitcoin' and everybody will get free money, the faint hearted shaky hands sold their bitcoins below 2500 just before the fork losing big time. Now, the conflict between 2x and core is endangering the existence of bitcoin, these same traders buy above 4K!!! Little they know that if S2X forks without replay protection, the fork will be a giant mess, both chains will be unusable for days, possibly weeks and the price will crash (maybe even below 1000$). a lot of people will hedge into LTC, ETH and BCH! It will look like bitcoin is dying while BCH is going up like crazy. Of course everyone who supports BCH wants exactly that! (At least the ones who can think that far and are interested in a high BCH price). The recent rise of the BTC price is just a bubble, created by chinese mining whales who want to sell high all and then dump BTC for good. They are free now from the limitation of the core team and can adjust the difficulty to make much bigger profits. Reading between the lines in Roger Ver's and Jihan Wu's tweets, they will trade most of their BTC for BCH and will continue to drive up BCH's price.

I want to be able to spend a little BTC on the fly -in meat world, in places where they have no facility to accept BTC.


ps-thanks for the recommendations I shall check them out and start ordering a few methinks.

15 hours.

11 confirmations

B_itCH is fucking awesome ! _/s

What? Stop spreading misinformation. The economic majority behind Bitcoin have agreed on the 2x blocksize increase. They are the vested interests who have the greatest say as to the future direction of Bitcoin. This has already been agreed upon.

We will be getting a block-size upgrade for BTC and Segwit1x can chose to maintain a non-contentious minority chain if they so chose.

I still can't fathom how they did it. I only signed in from one device. The password was stored in Chrome's manager and on my desktop, and that's it. I had a Chrome extension that wasn't properly vetted, but then I'd have thought they'd try and access my trade accounts, but nope, just Bitcointalk. It does makes me wonder if this site is compromised.

Anyway, back to up, up, up. Congrats to all hodlers.

I don't buy this "attack on Bitcoin" argument. So what if the chain gets spammed? That's exposing a weakness. What if Bitcoin actually got the mainstream adoption all these sycophants are constantly proclaiming? That spam would be replaced with "real" transactions. Old dice websites and others used to do 1 satoshi transactions all the time, there are legitimate reasons to send low value high volume transactions that aren't intentionally "malicious".

If core don't like the mempool being filled, they should alter their code to handle this. Unfortunately, they prefer to limit the block size and ensure that fees continue to rise, going so far to say $1,000 fees would be acceptable. Pushing transactions off chain is like a toddler pushing their toys under the bed to clean their room. They say things like it would be fine if it took as long as a year for a payment to settle as long as you could ensure it would eventually settle. That completely changes the fundamental currency claim of Bitcoin. It's not a settlement network.

-----BEGIN BITCOIN SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Ok, so my account yefi got hacked 2017-08-19. I'm a little shocked at this as my p/w was a random 9 digit code with a special character. It was also unique to this site. Anyway, please ignore anything my lobotomised impostor now writes, thank you.
-----BEGIN SIGNATURE-----
1NYG8FXzttGBxeyTpvefkG9qVEQUFRacQo
ILKE74zlefd0JdEr8uhy4EK9XsbeVUuDxPHyoMzPlFl5fJV2k0pmeNU1O7o00kUXY/9t5H7jJh7rXYjwmIYQq0k=
-----END BITCOIN SIGNED MESSAGE-----

Here is the unedited post where I posted that address: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=996318.msg13422402;topicseen#msg13422402

Bitcore is not worth the hassle.

Looks like some Core elite developer already has a M.A.D. plan ongoing:

https://twitter.com/LukeDashjr/status/901233811580702720

I am personally in favor of more decentralization in mining and all, so I tend to favor a change in PoW to end the Chinese miner's mafia, even if this could cause much chaos and desruption in the short to medium term. The question is if the new algo will be asic-resistant, or we'll be at square 1 in a few months.