All posts made by Istanbul34 in Bitcointalk.org's Wall Observer thread



1. Post 9795264 (copy this link) (by Istanbul34) (scraped on 2020-04-04_Sat_13.38h):

Quote from: prophetx on December 10, 2014, 04:55:25 AM
i think at this point in time bitcoin is a solution looking for a problem.

almost 24 months ago people though that bitcoin would revolutionize the business of international money transfers, people started working on designing ATMs, and fiat to bitcoin exchanges popped up in many jurisdictions. a solution to an old problem.

today we have some ATMs and a healthy number of exchanges, however both of these have very high regulatory costs.  as it turns out much of that "problem" is mostly the creation of various regulatory regimes, since we no longer generally ship around tons of gold on ships, that let us say are in place to allow incumbents to make money along with providing protocols that allow for reporting to governments primarily for reasons related to tax collection, but also the enforcement of embargoes, sanctions and the never ending hunt for organized crime (terror, drugs, etc).

frankly this is not what bitcoin, as one can plainly see, excels at.

one has to go back to the Satoshi Nakamoto white paper and re-read it occasionally to pull out new nuggets of insight based on what has transpired.

Quote
While the system works well enough for most transactions, it still suffers from the inherent weaknesses of the trust based model.
Completely non-reversible transactions are not really possible, since financial institutions cannot avoid mediating disputes.  The cost of mediation increases transaction costs, limiting the minimum practical transaction size and cutting off the possibility for small casual transactions, and there is a broader cost in the loss of ability to make non-reversible payments for nonreversible
services.

A few things to note here:

1. "the system works well enough for most transactions" means that Satoshi thought that "most transactions" concerning online commerce are handled well by the current system. therefor it is not likely that bitcoin applies to say the purchase of books on amazon.com.  Bitpay, circle and coinbase are sadly barking up the wrong tree.

2. so what is bitcoin perhaps good for?  there answer is right there in the first paragraph: "small casual transactions" and " non-reversible payments for nonreversible services".

What are interactions that may constitute say "small casual transactions"?

1. tipping - this has been relatively successful for reddit and doge it seems
2. online gambling - we can see that the dice sites appear to do decent business
3. ?
4. ??
5. Huh

What are "nonreversible services"?

1. the time stamping of a digital document
2. the use of processing power
3. the use of data storage
4. the escrowing of something of value
5. the execution of a contract between some parties
6. the delivery of data
7.
8.
9.

Now ask yourselves, how many bitcoin services and business do you know which fall into some of these categories?

And then you, I think, shall understand why we are not yet at $10000/btc.

When folks on here can start naming popular services in a majority of these categories, and perhaps others, then we will see not only the foundation for more wide spread adoption but also price.

Most of the investments in the current space by VC are really throwing money into a fire. But I have full confidence that in time (say 2-3 years) other groups that are more nimble and not necessarily driven by rigid business plans will begin to execute on these.  Of course that is the reason why I really like projects like Ethereum, Counterparty and Storj.




You forgot to mention NXT;

Promising projects are IMO;

- Jinn https://nxtforum.org/news-and-announcements/(ann)-jinn/
- DORCS https://lythmmo.com/
- Nxtty https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.nxtty.main&hl=nl_NL
- SkyNet http://finhive.com/roadmap.html
- superNET http://www.supernet.org/index.php/en/
- NXTpoker https://nxtforum.org/stark-industries-(nxtdice)/business-plan/

+ Many more projects which will use NXT as their "fuel".

Check http://nxtreporting.com for the actual price and http://www.secureae.com/ if you want to invest directly with BTC.

And ofcourse NXT is not stopping with developments as well;

http://www.nxttechnologytree.com/

There is one important reason why these people have chosen NXT over Bitcoin;

Once you bought the equipment to support the network of NXT you have a fixed cost of electricity of running a node ($20/month for a decent node) and no other fees.

In PoW you need to upgrade your equipment every 6 months to be able compete in the mining race, spend time to maintain the hardware, electricity fees increase as you compete to gain a larger share of hashrate to mine the same amount of coins as before (some of the electricity fees may be offset by more energy-efficient ASICs, but I would guess there is still an increase). In short, it's a nightmare. Only few large datacenters could survive in the end and then they could all be easily coerced to make a PoW crypto centralized and regulated.

With NXT; The power will always belong to the users.

Ps; Someone set up a solar powered Rasperry Pi with the software of NXT;




2. Post 9795845 (copy this link) (by Istanbul34) (scraped on 2020-04-04_Sat_13.38h):

Quote from: prophetx on December 10, 2014, 12:10:40 PM
i think at this point in time bitcoin is a solution looking for a problem.

almost 24 months ago people though that bitcoin would revolutionize the business of international money transfers, people started working on designing ATMs, and fiat to bitcoin exchanges popped up in many jurisdictions. a solution to an old problem.

today we have some ATMs and a healthy number of exchanges, however both of these have very high regulatory costs.  as it turns out much of that "problem" is mostly the creation of various regulatory regimes, since we no longer generally ship around tons of gold on ships, that let us say are in place to allow incumbents to make money along with providing protocols that allow for reporting to governments primarily for reasons related to tax collection, but also the enforcement of embargoes, sanctions and the never ending hunt for organized crime (terror, drugs, etc).

frankly this is not what bitcoin, as one can plainly see, excels at.

one has to go back to the Satoshi Nakamoto white paper and re-read it occasionally to pull out new nuggets of insight based on what has transpired.

Quote
While the system works well enough for most transactions, it still suffers from the inherent weaknesses of the trust based model.
Completely non-reversible transactions are not really possible, since financial institutions cannot avoid mediating disputes.  The cost of mediation increases transaction costs, limiting the minimum practical transaction size and cutting off the possibility for small casual transactions, and there is a broader cost in the loss of ability to make non-reversible payments for nonreversible
services.

A few things to note here:

1. "the system works well enough for most transactions" means that Satoshi thought that "most transactions" concerning online commerce are handled well by the current system. therefor it is not likely that bitcoin applies to say the purchase of books on amazon.com.  Bitpay, circle and coinbase are sadly barking up the wrong tree.

2. so what is bitcoin perhaps good for?  there answer is right there in the first paragraph: "small casual transactions" and " non-reversible payments for nonreversible services".

What are interactions that may constitute say "small casual transactions"?

1. tipping - this has been relatively successful for reddit and doge it seems
2. online gambling - we can see that the dice sites appear to do decent business
3. ?
4. ??
5. Huh

What are "nonreversible services"?

1. the time stamping of a digital document
2. the use of processing power
3. the use of data storage
4. the escrowing of something of value
5. the execution of a contract between some parties
6. the delivery of data
7.
8.
9.

Now ask yourselves, how many bitcoin services and business do you know which fall into some of these categories?

And then you, I think, shall understand why we are not yet at $10000/btc.

When folks on here can start naming popular services in a majority of these categories, and perhaps others, then we will see not only the foundation for more wide spread adoption but also price.

Most of the investments in the current space by VC are really throwing money into a fire. But I have full confidence that in time (say 2-3 years) other groups that are more nimble and not necessarily driven by rigid business plans will begin to execute on these.  Of course that is the reason why I really like projects like Ethereum, Counterparty and Storj.




You forgot to mention NXT;

[deleted text referring to potential scams]



With NXT; The power will always belong to the few whales.

Sorry but this is the BTC price movement and discussion thread.  i was discussing impacts on longer price movements and what we need to be seeing.

BTW what is up with all the NXT and XRP people these days?  I am totally for technically legit alt coin projects, but these guys just try to shove shit down everyone's throats.

hey guys here is a CLUE.... you you attract more flies with honey then vinegar...  although i guess shit seems to work too... lol

Just passed some information and someone reacted with FUD like always.

But you are right. Please discuss the price of Bitcoin. That's really important right now  Wink

My point was that there are projects that doesn't think about the price of the coin/asset all day long but want to create a better world.
Maybe the Bitcoin devs can be inspired by those projects.

I don't care if people here like NXT or not. Just do know that there are people out there working on many projects that will decentralize the world bit by bit thanks to NXT Wink

I don't want to interrupt. I'm out.



3. Post 9798277 (copy this link) (by Istanbul34) (scraped on 2020-04-04_Sat_13.38h):

Quote from: prophetx on December 10, 2014, 01:41:04 PM


Just passed some information and someone reacted with FUD like always.

But you are right. Please discuss the price of Bitcoin. That's really important right now  Wink

My point was that there are projects that doesn't think about the price of the coin/asset all day long but want to create a better world.
Maybe the Bitcoin devs can be inspired by those projects.

I don't care if people here like NXT or not. Just do know that there are people out there working on many projects that will decentralize the world bit by bit thanks to NXT Wink

I don't want to interrupt. I'm out.
if i wanted to react with FUD, I would have said things like:

1. why did the dev implement wallets that allowed many of the people's NXT to get stolen in the first month via a brut force attack
2. why did the dev close the crowd sale early and take money from someone who then pumped NXT for the benefit of himself and a very small group

and the list goes on...  sounds like a better world for sure... for a few manipulators... just for the record i actually liked NXT as a concept before the crowd sales but the actions afterwards and association with scammers is what brings it down.  just like association with drug market places makes btc unpalatable for much of the population.

btw not sure if you read the title of this thread but it is actually about BTC price movement tracking and discussion  Shocked Shocked Shocked Shocked

so what we do on this thread is discuss BTC price movement all day long

I understand. But with FUD I didn't mention your post but the post of Simakki.

I'm not a NXT expert but I can try to answer those question. You asked it anyway.

First. You have to understand that NXT was a completely new code and not a clone.

1. I agree that was a mistake. Many people were angry because they lost their NXT's. They used a very easy hackable password. They solved it with a client that generates a password for the user.

2. I don't understand what you mean. But the IPO was open for 2-3 months. It was a risky investment so many people didn't invest in it (and it wasn't closed early like you mentin). The people who did invest got a high share of NXT. The stakeholders didn't pump it. People saw and still see a very nice potential for the future so a lot of people bought in.

ps. A little bit of news today; “The really interesting thing that is deeply underpublicized is that NXT has had a very impressive set of smart contract capabilities for months now.” - SmartContract CEO Sergey Nazarov http://www.coindesk.com/new-blockchain-startup-brings-contracts-digital-age/

And don't forget to look into the new feature of NXT that will launch in January 2015; https://bitbucket.org/JeanLucPicard/nxt/issue/136/monetary-system

Now I'm here again. I should say something about the price of Bitcoin otherwise many people will get angry at me  Tongue

Christmas and New year is coming > Price will decline IMO.